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[校友答疑] 就读欧洲MBA有风险,跳坑须谨慎:你可能需要的不是MBA

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81#
发表于 2018-2-6 07:38:08 | 只看该作者
nevermindband 发表于 2018-2-5 22:06
IE 今年就給FT抓了

“We take the integrity of our rankings very seriously and this is not the first  ...

IE也不一定是造假吧,这个文章不能只看一半吧,断章取义就没意思了

The Financial Times began surveying Class of 2014 alumni on Sept. 11th. It apparently took a month before officials at IE Business School heard that their could be a problem. In mid-October, several alumni from the class said they had yet to receive a survey from the Financial Times. The school only became aware of the problem after delegates of the class encouraged graduates to complete the survey on WhatsApp groups and other social media. The school believes it had oudated email addresses for as many as 100 of the 577 grauates in its Class of 2014.

82#
发表于 2018-2-6 10:21:53 | 只看该作者
aluzeing 发表于 2018-2-6 07:38
IE也不一定是造假吧,这个文章不能只看一半吧,断章取义就没意思了

The Financial Times began surveyin ...

也難怪樓主覺得和你討論吃力,你有不同觀點,我建議你拋出來大家討論討論,真相越辯越明。但你隨便扣其他人帽子說其他人"斷章取義"就真的不太好了。如果是一對一的對話,我就隨你去了吧,沒必要花時間去寫一大篇文章去讓你更清楚事情的發展。但在討論區可不同了,我怕如果我不好好回應,其他人真的以為事情如你所形容一樣了

John Byrne 為這件事寫了兩篇文章。第一篇是FT出來了,IE卻不見了的時候(28號)寫的。
https://poetsandquants.com/2018/01/28/why-ie-business-school-lost-its-ft-ranking/

當時FT 尚未回應事件,大家只可以由他們的statement 去估計發生什么事

“This year we have taken the decision to exclude Spain’s IE Business School because of irregularities in their submission"

IE當時就回應指Alumni directory 更新維護得不夠好
"IE officials say that the school did not have updated email addresses for all of the 577 graduates in IE’s Class of 2014."

後來,FT的人回應了事件,John Byrne再發出了新的文章(30號):
https://poetsandquants.com/2018/01/30/financial-times-excluded-ie-from-ranking-due-to-irregularities/

FT is making clear that the quality of the data in the surveys was unreliable because the newspaper suspected that in some cases surveys were filled out by people who were not intended to complete them

“We take the integrity of our rankings very seriously and this is not the first time a school has been disqualified,”

這次事情就很清楚了,FT明確指出這是關係到Integrity 的事。細心想一下,如果只是Alumni directory 不夠更新電郵地址沒有更新,那事情發展大概變成FT發了問卷後,可能會收到系統回覆說電郵地址不對,或電郵留在inbox 沒人回覆,導致IE的回覆問題率太低被踢出去。但怎樣也不會發展成為"some cases surveys were filled out by people who were not intended to complete them"吧。

IE這事對FT打擊也是不少的。John 的文章也刻意把FT的內部人事調動搬上枱面來,不知道事情在未來會不會有更多突破性的發展,只能密切留意

Helen Barrett, work & careers editor for the FT who is responsible for business education rankings, was involved in the decision to exclude IE from the ranking. Up until 2016, the rankings were overseen by long-time business education editor Della Bradshaw

如果你手頭上有更好的資料,歡迎你分享討論,
83#
发表于 2018-2-6 17:21:06 | 只看该作者
nevermindband 发表于 2018-2-6 10:21
也難怪樓主覺得和你討論吃力,你有不同觀點,我建議你拋出來大家討論討論,真相越辯越明。但你隨便扣其他 ...

应该说现在的情况是IE和FT都没有完全没有确认是造假还是邮件信箱出现了问题。楼主可还说有邮箱被hack这种事情。。。。

如果是邮箱地址发错了,也一样会出现“‘SURVEYS WERE COMPLETED BY PEOPLE WHO WERE NOT WHO WE THOUGHT THEY WERE"的情况。所以,没必要现在给IE扣个帽子说,IE是因为造假而被逐出排名的。如果现在就很贸然的下了这个结论(IE就是靠造假才有现在的排名),应该可以算是”断章取义“了吧

我只是用中立的观点看这件事情,楼主可是说欧洲很多学校包括top3的就业报告都不能看~~
84#
发表于 2018-2-6 17:53:07 | 只看该作者
aluzeing 发表于 2018-2-6 17:21
应该说现在的情况是IE和FT都没有完全没有确认是造假还是邮件信箱出现了问题。楼主可还说有邮箱被hack这种 ...

朋友,我拿出報導內容來討論。你拿出"还说有邮箱被hack这种"的推論來回覆。然後你就自行為我的話腦補了個結論,結果就是我斷章取義了。

天呀,Hackers也挺有空的,特意去Hack一百多個郵箱,還不是IE Alumni的不去Hack,Hack完還要去花個時間填問卷。倒不如我來打個圓場吧:其實事情是外星人在木星附近決戰,其能量影響了時間的進行,令地球局部地區進入了時間的裂縫,導致電郵亂發問卷亂填吧。

我們就在這裡打住了討論吧。再討論下去也是沒什么進展的。謝謝。
85#
发表于 2018-2-6 17:56:40 | 只看该作者
nevermindband 发表于 2018-2-6 17:53
朋友,我拿出報導內容來討論。你拿出"还说有邮箱被hack这种"的推論來回覆。然後你就自行為我的話腦補了 ...

朋友,我没有说你在说有hacker(hack用词不当这里),应该说是不是造假这件事情下定论是不是太早了
楼主可是说”FT排名会同时survey在校生和校友。作假被抓的,nevermindband已经发了,事实胜过雄辩。果然假信息是可以通过制造假学生/校友邮件地址来输入的,真是只有想不到,没有做不到。”
86#
发表于 2018-2-6 20:21:25 | 只看该作者
當FT說是“We take the integrity of our rankings very seriously and this is not the first time a school has been disqualified”
能用integrity 這個字, 這就是FT在說某些學校(IE)處理得很不道德, 而不只是不小心錯誤和疏忽.

懂看英文, 不太天真的, 都不會說造假这件事情下定论是太早了.......(當然, 利益相關人仕另計.)


當然, 今回東窗事發的就只IE一家, 有沒有其他的呢? god knows........
87#
 楼主| 发表于 2018-2-6 23:14:19 | 只看该作者
cheesechan 发表于 2018-2-6 20:21
當FT說是“We take the integrity of our rankings very seriously and this is not the first time a scho ...

同意!               
88#
发表于 2018-2-6 23:54:44 | 只看该作者

其實我有點懷疑aluzeing是IE的利益相關人仕.....e.g. 舊生之類.
89#
 楼主| 发表于 2018-2-7 00:23:11 | 只看该作者
cheesechan 发表于 2018-2-6 23:54
其實我有點懷疑aluzeing是IE的利益相關人仕.....e.g. 舊生之類.

如果是老生应该三五年过去已经没有太大直接利益相关了,留学咨询更加可能吧。
如果没有利益相关,只能说是抬杠爱好者了。
90#
发表于 2018-2-7 02:29:41 | 只看该作者
cheesechan 发表于 2018-2-6 20:21
當FT說是“We take the integrity of our rankings very seriously and this is not the first time a scho ...

你再次证明了自己的逻辑推理多厉害~ 这个论坛上第一个说IE被disqualify的估计也是我了吧~
我喷了IE不知道年了,竟然能被你诬陷相关人士~~
https://forum.chasedream.com/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=1314941
https://forum.chasedream.com/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=1311283
呵呵

来来来,来说一下,整篇文章看完后,哪里有标明是IE是cheat而被除名的?这段文字可以推理得知是IE cheat了?
the newspaper said, “The FT Global MBA rankings are calculated after extensive in-house analysis of data submitted by the schools themselves. This year we have taken the decision to exclude Spain’s IE Business School because of irregularities in their submission. We have contacted the school’s leadership to request that it urgently tightens its data collection procedures so that it can be included in future rankings.”
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