2nd AD@Columbia MAFN VS Oxford MFE，纠结求选校

PerduAnge

Without concerns about family, you can go US without barriages.

-- by 会员 mycontrol01 (2011/3/21 19:23:50)

sorry but what do you mean by wihout barriages?

PerduAnge

actually, these two programs could give you a chance to land a job in IB, but it is up to you whether you can realize it. In my mind, OX is definitely a better choice.

At NYC, you have to fight with other newly minted MBA, masters, unders...who come there for financial jobs, but there are more schools that are comparable with Columbia at USA.

-- by 会员 mycontrol01 (2011/3/21 10:07:59)

Agree. With MAFN, you fight iwth MBA's, top ivy undergraduates etcs.

Schools Reputation:
Columbia is Ivy. Ivy is good. But in US, you have Harvard, Princeton, Yale, Stanford, MIT, schools that people generally consider more prestigious and cooler than Columbia. There is no discussion that these schools have edge over Columbia.

In UK, there are three schools people talk about. Cambridge, Oxford, LSE. These are the top three, with Oxbridge coming before LSE.

Then there is this talk about how Colubmia and Oxford is regarded in China/HK. Even mom of mine knows Oxford, I bet she is yet to hear about Columbia. Well actually that was a joke... Seriously,I don't live in china/HK, I have not done a research regarding what every IB think of columbia and oxford, I dare to say such research is yet to be done, or is done but never will be released.

Program wise:

Kidding me? Do you want to learn formulas that is never asked during interviews? If yes, go MAFN. TrustOxford MFE is TOP TIER IN EUROPE. Mention a peer program in Europe that is as good as the Oxford MFE. Please don't say LSE MSC FINANCE or LBS MFIN...  This should not even be brought up as a discussion. MFE >>>> MAFN unless you are PASSIONATE about MATH....


Location wise:
It's London vs New York. Columbia is in the city of New York. But coming from China, trust me, you don't have access to the snobby network New York upper classes is offering you. Same for London.

As a place to live, there is no discussion about New York >>>>>>>>>>>> London. I mean, there are hot girls in NY. Find me a hot girl in London... Nah just joke... Europe is more conservative compared to NY. As a Chinese, you get better off in US.

Job Market wise:
They are pretty much the same. NY is bigger, more deals, more products, more MM shops etcs. But once again, you compete with more elite schools etcs.

-- by 会员 infu (2011/3/21 17:13:06)

Thank you for the explanation in such details.
I have just heard from a former student in Oxford MFE that finding a job in London after graduating from ox Mfe is not as difficult as imagined maybe out of the brand name of Oxford. At the same time, it has been said that the opportunity in NY is not as good after the MAFN.
About math, while I do not hate math, I mean no, i am not that passionate about it.
About the 'snobby network', well, maybe some technical job would be a good start. I may deal with the 'upper class' later.
About hot girls, guess I will catch up with that later as well.
Off to Oxford, I guess.
Another question, how fat is the chance for me to get a job in US after working in London for 2 years, if all went smoothly?

-- by 会员 PerduAnge (2011/3/21 17:27:49)

It depends. Internal transfer in a BB is always possible. I condemn it is harder in reality. But my question is, why do you want to move?

-- by 会员 infu (2011/3/21 23:09:11)

for family reasons..........

PerduAnge

so you exchange your network and P&L/industry expertise for more fun and friendly?

-- by 会员 infu (2011/3/21 23:33:54)

well i like London...actually i admit i like london better...but i am afraid that i may need the move for at least two reasons:
1, i guess it is not easy or possible to immigrate to uk?
2, i think there would be more opportunities in US?

PerduAnge

为啥在伦敦工作了还要去美国，你想移民美帝么？

-- by 会员 无法阻挡的兔子 (2011/3/21 18:30:27)

not sure for now...can be a choice to consider, though...

PerduAnge

actually, these two programs could give you a chance to land a job in IB, but it is up to you whether you can realize it. In my mind, OX is definitely a better choice.

At NYC, you have to fight with other newly minted MBA, masters, unders...who come there for financial jobs, but there are more schools that are comparable with Columbia at USA.

-- by 会员 mycontrol01 (2011/3/21 10:07:59)

Agree. With MAFN, you fight iwth MBA's, top ivy undergraduates etcs.

Schools Reputation:
Columbia is Ivy. Ivy is good. But in US, you have Harvard, Princeton, Yale, Stanford, MIT, schools that people generally consider more prestigious and cooler than Columbia. There is no discussion that these schools have edge over Columbia.

In UK, there are three schools people talk about. Cambridge, Oxford, LSE. These are the top three, with Oxbridge coming before LSE.

Then there is this talk about how Colubmia and Oxford is regarded in China/HK. Even mom of mine knows Oxford, I bet she is yet to hear about Columbia. Well actually that was a joke... Seriously,I don't live in china/HK, I have not done a research regarding what every IB think of columbia and oxford, I dare to say such research is yet to be done, or is done but never will be released.

Program wise:

Kidding me? Do you want to learn formulas that is never asked during interviews? If yes, go MAFN. TrustOxford MFE is TOP TIER IN EUROPE. Mention a peer program in Europe that is as good as the Oxford MFE. Please don't say LSE MSC FINANCE or LBS MFIN...  This should not even be brought up as a discussion. MFE >>>> MAFN unless you are PASSIONATE about MATH....


Location wise:
It's London vs New York. Columbia is in the city of New York. But coming from China, trust me, you don't have access to the snobby network New York upper classes is offering you. Same for London.

As a place to live, there is no discussion about New York >>>>>>>>>>>> London. I mean, there are hot girls in NY. Find me a hot girl in London... Nah just joke... Europe is more conservative compared to NY. As a Chinese, you get better off in US.

Job Market wise:
They are pretty much the same. NY is bigger, more deals, more products, more MM shops etcs. But once again, you compete with more elite schools etcs.

-- by 会员 infu (2011/3/21 17:13:06)

Thank you for the explanation in such details.
I have just heard from a former student in Oxford MFE that finding a job in London after graduating from ox Mfe is not as difficult as imagined maybe out of the brand name of Oxford. At the same time, it has been said that the opportunity in NY is not as good after the MAFN.
About math, while I do not hate math, I mean no, i am not that passionate about it.
About the 'snobby network', well, maybe some technical job would be a good start. I may deal with the 'upper class' later.
About hot girls, guess I will catch up with that later as well.
Off to Oxford, I guess.
Another question, how fat is the chance for me to get a job in US after working in London for 2 years, if all went smoothly?

-- by 会员 PerduAnge (2011/3/21 17:27:49)

It depends. Internal transfer in a BB is always possible. I condemn it is harder in reality. But my question is, why do you want to move?

-- by 会员 infu (2011/3/21 23:09:11)

NYC is much more friendly and fun for foreigners than London.

-- by 会员 youayou (2011/3/21 23:25:21)

yeah that can be a good reason, and much more dynamic i guess?
i used to talk with an international teacher in uk, she consider it rather dull in uk?

youayou

actually, these two programs could give you a chance to land a job in IB, but it is up to you whether you can realize it. In my mind, OX is definitely a better choice.

At NYC, you have to fight with other newly minted MBA, masters, unders...who come there for financial jobs, but there are more schools that are comparable with Columbia at USA.

-- by 会员 mycontrol01 (2011/3/21 10:07:59)

Agree. With MAFN, you fight iwth MBA's, top ivy undergraduates etcs.

Schools Reputation:
Columbia is Ivy. Ivy is good. But in US, you have Harvard, Princeton, Yale, Stanford, MIT, schools that people generally consider more prestigious and cooler than Columbia. There is no discussion that these schools have edge over Columbia.

In UK, there are three schools people talk about. Cambridge, Oxford, LSE. These are the top three, with Oxbridge coming before LSE.

Then there is this talk about how Colubmia and Oxford is regarded in China/HK. Even mom of mine knows Oxford, I bet she is yet to hear about Columbia. Well actually that was a joke... Seriously,I don't live in china/HK, I have not done a research regarding what every IB think of columbia and oxford, I dare to say such research is yet to be done, or is done but never will be released.

Program wise:

Kidding me? Do you want to learn formulas that is never asked during interviews? If yes, go MAFN. TrustOxford MFE is TOP TIER IN EUROPE. Mention a peer program in Europe that is as good as the Oxford MFE. Please don't say LSE MSC FINANCE or LBS MFIN...  This should not even be brought up as a discussion. MFE >>>> MAFN unless you are PASSIONATE about MATH....


Location wise:
It's London vs New York. Columbia is in the city of New York. But coming from China, trust me, you don't have access to the snobby network New York upper classes is offering you. Same for London.

As a place to live, there is no discussion about New York >>>>>>>>>>>> London. I mean, there are hot girls in NY. Find me a hot girl in London... Nah just joke... Europe is more conservative compared to NY. As a Chinese, you get better off in US.

Job Market wise:
They are pretty much the same. NY is bigger, more deals, more products, more MM shops etcs. But once again, you compete with more elite schools etcs.

-- by 会员 infu (2011/3/21 17:13:06)

Thank you for the explanation in such details.
I have just heard from a former student in Oxford MFE that finding a job in London after graduating from ox Mfe is not as difficult as imagined maybe out of the brand name of Oxford. At the same time, it has been said that the opportunity in NY is not as good after the MAFN.
About math, while I do not hate math, I mean no, i am not that passionate about it.
About the 'snobby network', well, maybe some technical job would be a good start. I may deal with the 'upper class' later.
About hot girls, guess I will catch up with that later as well.
Off to Oxford, I guess.
Another question, how fat is the chance for me to get a job in US after working in London for 2 years, if all went smoothly?

-- by 会员 PerduAnge (2011/3/21 17:27:49)

It depends. Internal transfer in a BB is always possible. I condemn it is harder in reality. But my question is, why do you want to move?

-- by 会员 infu (2011/3/21 23:09:11)

NYC is much more friendly and fun for foreigners than London.

-- by 会员 youayou (2011/3/21 23:25:21)

yeah that can be a good reason, and much more dynamic i guess?
i used to talk with an international teacher in uk, she consider it rather dull in uk?

-- by 会员 PerduAnge (2011/3/21 23:44:23)

My manager is from London. He said London is too conservative and bureaucratic. Not good for young man. He also mentioned girls in NYC are more open and pretty.

elva2sam

congratulations.!!既然你想直接回来的话其实差别不是很大吧
hk的话C会slightly better,  个人意见哦~~

-- by 会员 无法阻挡的兔子 (2011/3/18 19:15:08)

如果是想在国外先工作两年呢？很纠结，因为一年前如果从Oxford出来的话可以在伦敦做，而且这个项目在伦敦很受欢迎，但是现在英国的签证政策实在是。。。如果实在美洲国家找工作的话，哥大会不会比Oxford好很多呢？

-- by 会员 PerduAnge (2011/3/18 23:11:26)

其实现在英国的签证也没有变 以前是怎样以后基本上还是怎样的
如果你只是想要一份工作 那种能Sponsor你visa  然后发展又还可以的工作，那四大（or第五大），一些500强，还有ib的back office的工作都还是比较容易找的(尤其是ib的tech部扩张得厉害，也不要求prior experience 还蛮多中国人拿到的。)  

不过如果你想做banker or trader or any FO role，那就比较tough了。
直接申graduate program竞争会很激烈，基本上都要求solid relevant internship experience (本来是不需要的，但是这两年FO的headcount cut了，而且越来越多的peer都已经有n个BB internship了 要求也就自然水涨船高~ 有点类似我们中国人考G要上多少多少分才有竞争力的感觉 是不成文的要求了

所以现在英国进fo(尤其是2010年开始)比较reasonable的route就是先申请internship，然后再转fulltime或者没被convert成fulltime也没关系，可以申请别家的fulltime。       因为你一旦break into london ib 这个圈子／intern pool之后 申fulltime都很容易了。

但是这样你就要多等一年开始工作了~
如果你愿意等那一年的话我觉得 英国还是值得来的单从学校来说 ox那个项目至少找个非IB的GRADUATE JOB或者IB intern还是比较有望的

ps：我听我u penn的同学说美国现在也不好找工作啦？你可以具体问问美国的同学就业情况如何

蒙太奇

congratulations.!!既然你想直接回来的话其实差别不是很大吧
hk的话C会slightly better,  个人意见哦~~

-- by 会员 无法阻挡的兔子 (2011/3/18 19:15:08)

如果是想在国外先工作两年呢？很纠结，因为一年前如果从Oxford出来的话可以在伦敦做，而且这个项目在伦敦很受欢迎，但是现在英国的签证政策实在是。。。如果实在美洲国家找工作的话，哥大会不会比Oxford好很多呢？

-- by 会员 PerduAnge (2011/3/18 23:11:26)

其实现在英国的签证也没有变 以前是怎样以后基本上还是怎样的
如果你只是想要一份工作 那种能Sponsor你visa  然后发展又还可以的工作，那四大（or第五大），一些500强，还有ib的back office的工作都还是比较容易找的(尤其是ib的tech部扩张得厉害，也不要求prior experience 还蛮多中国人拿到的。)  

不过如果你想做banker or trader or any FO role，那就比较tough了。
直接申graduate program竞争会很激烈，基本上都要求solid relevant internship experience (本来是不需要的，但是这两年FO的headcount cut了，而且越来越多的peer都已经有n个BB internship了 要求也就自然水涨船高~ 有点类似我们中国人考G要上多少多少分才有竞争力的感觉 是不成文的要求了

所以现在英国进fo(尤其是2010年开始)比较reasonable的route就是先申请internship，然后再转fulltime或者没被convert成fulltime也没关系，可以申请别家的fulltime。       因为你一旦break into london ib 这个圈子／intern pool之后 申fulltime都很容易了。

但是这样你就要多等一年开始工作了~
如果你愿意等那一年的话我觉得 英国还是值得来的单从学校来说 ox那个项目至少找个非IB的GRADUATE JOB或者IB intern还是比较有望的

ps：我听我u penn的同学说美国现在也不好找工作啦？你可以具体问问美国的同学就业情况如何

-- by 会员 elva2sam (2011/3/22 4:13:36)

既然有人询问OX在美的工作情况。。我想问下COLUMBIA去英国有可能找到工作吗？其实我觉得大家还忘记了另外一个地方，荷兰。荷兰貌似有2家巨型企业，我觉得也非常不错。

elva2sam

congratulations.!!既然你想直接回来的话其实差别不是很大吧
hk的话C会slightly better,  个人意见哦~~

-- by 会员 无法阻挡的兔子 (2011/3/18 19:15:08)

如果是想在国外先工作两年呢？很纠结，因为一年前如果从Oxford出来的话可以在伦敦做，而且这个项目在伦敦很受欢迎，但是现在英国的签证政策实在是。。。如果实在美洲国家找工作的话，哥大会不会比Oxford好很多呢？

-- by 会员 PerduAnge (2011/3/18 23:11:26)

其实现在英国的签证也没有变 以前是怎样以后基本上还是怎样的
如果你只是想要一份工作 那种能Sponsor你visa  然后发展又还可以的工作，那四大（or第五大），一些500强，还有ib的back office的工作都还是比较容易找的(尤其是ib的tech部扩张得厉害，也不要求prior experience 还蛮多中国人拿到的。)  

不过如果你想做banker or trader or any FO role，那就比较tough了。
直接申graduate program竞争会很激烈，基本上都要求solid relevant internship experience (本来是不需要的，但是这两年FO的headcount cut了，而且越来越多的peer都已经有n个BB internship了 要求也就自然水涨船高~ 有点类似我们中国人考G要上多少多少分才有竞争力的感觉 是不成文的要求了

所以现在英国进fo(尤其是2010年开始)比较reasonable的route就是先申请internship，然后再转fulltime或者没被convert成fulltime也没关系，可以申请别家的fulltime。       因为你一旦break into london ib 这个圈子／intern pool之后 申fulltime都很容易了。

但是这样你就要多等一年开始工作了~
如果你愿意等那一年的话我觉得 英国还是值得来的单从学校来说 ox那个项目至少找个非IB的GRADUATE JOB或者IB intern还是比较有望的

ps：我听我u penn的同学说美国现在也不好找工作啦？你可以具体问问美国的同学就业情况如何

-- by 会员 elva2sam (2011/3/22 4:13:36)

既然有人询问OX在美的工作情况。。我想问下COLUMBIA去英国有可能找到工作吗？其实我觉得大家还忘记了另外一个地方，荷兰。荷兰貌似有2家巨型企业，我觉得也非常不错。

-- by 会员 蒙太奇 (2011/3/22 4:36:03)

难道蒙兄也想来英国工作吗？


今年CITI GRADUATE + INTERN INTAKE里有好几个美国大学的... BROWN, YALE, NYU, USC 神马的， 还有几个是那几所TOP 文理学院的


其他BANK 我就不知道了... 可能US BANK 会招美国大学的


COLUMBIA来英国应该不会比这几所差吧.... 所以你问有可能吗？ 当然是有可能性的吧...

PerduAnge

congratulations.!!既然你想直接回来的话其实差别不是很大吧
hk的话C会slightly better,  个人意见哦~~

-- by 会员 无法阻挡的兔子 (2011/3/18 19:15:08)

如果是想在国外先工作两年呢？很纠结，因为一年前如果从Oxford出来的话可以在伦敦做，而且这个项目在伦敦很受欢迎，但是现在英国的签证政策实在是。。。如果实在美洲国家找工作的话，哥大会不会比Oxford好很多呢？

-- by 会员 PerduAnge (2011/3/18 23:11:26)

其实现在英国的签证也没有变 以前是怎样以后基本上还是怎样的
如果你只是想要一份工作 那种能Sponsor你visa  然后发展又还可以的工作，那四大（or第五大），一些500强，还有ib的back office的工作都还是比较容易找的(尤其是ib的tech部扩张得厉害，也不要求prior experience 还蛮多中国人拿到的。)  

不过如果你想做banker or trader or any FO role，那就比较tough了。
直接申graduate program竞争会很激烈，基本上都要求solid relevant internship experience (本来是不需要的，但是这两年FO的headcount cut了，而且越来越多的peer都已经有n个BB internship了 要求也就自然水涨船高~ 有点类似我们中国人考G要上多少多少分才有竞争力的感觉 是不成文的要求了

所以现在英国进fo(尤其是2010年开始)比较reasonable的route就是先申请internship，然后再转fulltime或者没被convert成fulltime也没关系，可以申请别家的fulltime。       因为你一旦break into london ib 这个圈子／intern pool之后 申fulltime都很容易了。

但是这样你就要多等一年开始工作了~
如果你愿意等那一年的话我觉得 英国还是值得来的单从学校来说 ox那个项目至少找个非IB的GRADUATE JOB或者IB intern还是比较有望的

ps：我听我u penn的同学说美国现在也不好找工作啦？你可以具体问问美国的同学就业情况如何

-- by 会员 elva2sam (2011/3/22 4:13:36)

既然有人询问OX在美的工作情况。。我想问下COLUMBIA去英国有可能找到工作吗？其实我觉得大家还忘记了另外一个地方，荷兰。荷兰貌似有2家巨型企业，我觉得也非常不错。

-- by 会员 蒙太奇 (2011/3/22 4:36:03)

难道蒙兄也想来英国工作吗？


今年CITI GRADUATE + INTERN INTAKE里有好几个美国大学的... BROWN, YALE, NYU, USC 神马的， 还有几个是那几所TOP 文理学院的


其他BANK 我就不知道了... 可能US BANK 会招美国大学的


COLUMBIA来英国应该不会比这几所差吧.... 所以你问有可能吗？ 当然是有可能性的吧...

-- by 会员 elva2sam (2011/3/22 7:51:59)

如果不在UK的话找London的实习或者工作会不会障碍很大呢？毕竟面试、签证啥的都不方便~