Conell in BW' NEWS & INTERVIEWS

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A Talk with Cornell's B-School Admissions Director

Natalie Grinblatt, director of the office of admissions and financial aid at Cornell University's Johnson School of Management, offers some tips for prospective applicants
Our guest on February 7, 2002, was Natalie Grinblatt, director of the office of admissions and financial aid at Cornell University's Johnson School of Management (No. 8 on BusinessWeek's Top 30 list). Prior to joining the Johnson School, Grinblatt held positions in admissions and student services at the University of Michigan Business School, where she received her MBA in 1987. She has also worked in retail management and buying for Federated Department Stores. She was interviewed by BusinessWeek Online reporter Mica Schneider. Following are edited excerpts from their discussion:

Q: Who's the best candidate for Cornell's B-school?
A: Someone who's a leader. We look for a candidate who isn't only going to succeed in our program academically, but who is going to lead. There's a distinct leadership quality we look for: being able to assess a situation and seize opportunities or create new ones that have positive results for an organization. This requires independent thinking and collaboration. Both qualities are valued at the Johnson School. There are many people who can reach a goal, but we look for that extra something -- the ability to make a difference.

It's also important for people to know themselves extremely well, to know about the school, and how it will help them achieve their goals.

Q: How does Cornell determine such leadership skills from an MBA application?
A: We look at the applicant's academic record: their courses, grades, institution, course loads, and the trends in their record, which are hopefully upward. We also want to see what the candidate did outside of school, since sometimes this impacts their grades. The interview and the essays are other ways to tell the admissions officers your story. We ask for specific examples of what applicants have done.

Q: On the flip side, who isn't right for Johnson?
A: There are a couple of things that go wrong with an application. One of the fatal flaws that people make is that they don't answer the question asked in our essays -- that happens often. Or they don't have examples. They'll write or speak about something, but never make it personal. You should describe an achievement to the admissions officer then say, "For example, here's how I did this or that." Applicants need to come across well and communicate well. I realize the word limits for our essays are challenging. However, if you can't get your message across, the competition will.

Q: Cornell offers a 12-month MBA program, too. Who's a prime candidate for that program?
A: The minimum qualification to be considered for the 12-month program is a Master's degree or higher in the physical or natural sciences, or in engineering. You can't apply if you only have a Bachelor's degree in chemistry. People who do very well in this program aren't making a dramatic career change, but want to move onto the business side of the business they're already in -- for instance, someone who is working at a biotech company as a scientist and wants to return to biotech on the business side.

We bring 50 students into the program every spring, and we get 150 to 250 applications. I'm looking for the same qualities as for the full-time program. The students transition into the full-time MBA program in the fall, after they complete their core courses in the spring. Those are the same ones that students in the full-time program take, but in a shorter period of time.

Q: How does Cornell use the GMAT to evaluate candidates?
A: How we utilize the GMAT depends on someone's background. We recognize that international students, who don't all have English as a native tongue, may have difficulty with verbal reasoning. We also look at TOEFL scores for non-native English speakers, and use the interview to evaluate such candidates' [English skills].

The GMAT helps me determine how well a person will perform in the program academically. After that, I look for other things. We turn down people who score in the 99th percentile on the quantitative [section of the GMAT], but who lack leadership qualities, focus, and the passion and drive that we're looking for.

Q: What's the cut off for a GMAT score that will stop an applicant from being considered seriously by the admissions committee?
A: We don't have a cut off. And I've surprised myself sometimes in terms of some of the people we've accepted. There are other indicators that tell me that someone will be fine in a program, such as a strong academic record, a history of not doing well on tests and showing that [to the admissions committee], or the foresight to prepare for an MBA program by taking coursework and doing well. I'd suggest taking courses such as accounting, if you've never had it before. If you don't do well in this course, it's a whole other story. Microeconomics and statistics are also key, if people haven't had exposure to them. Typically, it's liberal arts majors who end up behind the eight ball.

Q: What suggestions can you offer to people who are about to write their Cornell essays?
A: One thing I hear from students is that it's challenging to write about themselves in 400 words or less. We want people to communicate their story succinctly. Forget what you learned in expository English and get to the point. Flowery language doesn't fit well with business writing. Also, this is an essay, so don't bold phrases or bullet point key issues.

Answer the questions that are asked. Stick to our word limit. Stick to the point. Be honest, and don't guess at what we want to hear. Talk about your passions. Please, please, please have at least two people review your essays for typos and grammatical errors. I can't tell you how often I see..."My roll as a manger." That won't be picked up in spell check. It's not just the international applicants who make that mistake.

The other big problem is what I call the cut and paste fiasco. No school wants to see that their competitor is the "only school for you." I see this mistake in more than three dozen applications each year. Right there, the credibility is shot. One of the things that sometimes trips candidates up is that we do ask to which other schools have they applied. We are looking for a consistent theme here or at least valid decisions for applying to the schools. Do not, by any means, cut down on other schools in order to highlight your desire to attend our program. It's not necessary.

Q: What have you noticed about this year's applicant pool?
A: The objective measures -- undergraduate GPA and GMAT -- seem to be stronger this year. Applications are up, and it's a combination of more applicants, as well as [applicants submitting] more applications [to different schools]. I tend to think that there are more applications than there are applicants.

You have to be bright in order to do well in this program. [Being bright] is specific to a given applicant pool's skills. You have to be able to achieve academic success in the year you're entering a program. In a year such as this one, where the quality of the pool is up and numbers are up, the bar is higher.

Q: Describe the things you don't want to find out about a person on his or her recommendations.
A: Oh, I could tell you stories. I'd tell a candidate to give their recommenders a copy of their essays, the evaluation form that all schools use, plus a resume and a cover letter, telling the recommender what to highlight and affirm from the person's application. We want recommendations from supervisors. We ask for two letters of recommendation, and one from each kind of supervisor, such as one from volunteer work and one from full-time work, is fine.

I understand that not every one can go to their supervisor [to ask for a recommendation], so those applicants should explain that. Don't leave the admissions committee guessing. Write a cover letter or use an optional essay to explain why you aren't using a supervisor as a recommender.

Q: Applicants often believe that submitting a recommendation from an alumnus gives them an edge. They say the same can be true if an alumnus calls the school to put in a good word on their behalf. What's your reaction to such calls?
A: We ask our alumni to e-mail us, so we have a paper trail. We put the note in the applicant's file. Having an alumnus, whose opinion we respect, recommend an applicant may give a marginal candidate -- someone who's on the bubble -- some help in at least getting an interview. It helps to bring that person to our attention. But there are a lot of people who get in without the help of alumni.

Q: What should applicants anticipate in their Cornell interview?
A: We interview about one-third of the applicants, and admit about half of those we interview. Invitational interviews definitely put more pressure on the candidate.

There are definite things we look for in the interview. We're first going to look at a candidate's information from their application, and if there are things that we need to ask, we'll ask. We're going to ask them about their careers, their goals, and how our program fits into those goals. Why have they made some of the decisions they've made? We'll explore how the applicant analyzes problems, but I can't tell you how. That would ruin it. We'll explore leadership, because it's a key aspect of the program, as are team skills.

We may ask questions regarding current business events -- my favorite this week has been Enron -- so candidates should scan their most recent issue of BusinessWeek and read BusinessWeek Online for the day. We are also going to assess their interpersonal skills. Remember -- strong handshake, eye contact, and good energy.

It also pays to know the school well. Is the candidate applying to the program because of our emphasis on experiential learning through the Parker Center, which gives students an opportunity to do equity research? Are they interested in the Park Leadership Fellows Program, which is a fellowship for 30 domestic students each year; the Big Red Venture Fund; or one of Cornell's immersions in investment banking, brand management, entrepreneurship and private equity, manufacturing, e-business, or managerial finance? Many of our students take advantage of the overall strength of Cornell by taking coursework in our engineering school, industrial and labor relations, international programs, the hotel school (the wines course is very popular with MBA students), etc. Are candidates with scientific or engineering backgrounds interested in our 12-month option? These are all questions that should be answered before the application can be completed.

While we invite everyone to interview at Sage Hall because we feel it's important to understand the Johnson experience, we realize that may not be a viable option for everyone. Therefore, alumni are available to conduct interviews throughout the world. All interviews are weighted equally.

Q: Just 51% of Cornell's admitted MBAs enrolled in the program in 2001. Where are they going instead? What's the school doing to improve that figure?
A: Everything we do we hope will help attract more students to Cornell, such as [offering a] tremendous amount of personal contact. Once [prospective students] get to know what we're about, and through these personal contacts, they're in a much better position to make a decision. All of it is very personal -- happy hours with alumni, weekends in Ithaca, phone calls, and other things. But people also have to make choices. Some go to other top-10 programs. Others want to work for another year or skip school for other reasons. We don't allow admitted applicants to defer, so those people would have to reapply.

Q: How does Cornell rely on its wait list?
A: It depends on the year. Two years ago, I took 30 people off of the wait list. Last year, I only took four. The nice thing about the wait list is that it gives me an opportunity to get to know people better. We usually have a decent size wait list. If what we've seen so far [in application volume] is the result of an increase in applications, not an increase in individual applicants, then most of our competitors will be duking it out for students over the summer.

In our wait-list letter, we indicate a couple of things applicants can do. First, if there were deficiencies in their application, they may want to address those. Also, they should update us on what's happening to them. For instance, if they've had a promotion, or found a new job.

Q: Getting into Cornell's B-school isn't all an applicant must do. Tuition for the 2002-03 academic year will be an estimated $30,975. How helpful can admitted applicants expect Cornell's financial aid office to be?
A: We're always here. The director and financial-aid counselor do a great job. Essentially, we try to give students advice on what they need to do in order to prepare financially for school, including utilizing savings. People don't want to go completely in debt. The nice thing is that the payback period is relatively short because our graduates are getting well-paying jobs.

The best advice we can give is to get rid of your consumer debt. Get rid of your Visa, or your L.L. Bean debt. It's going to be very difficult to get loans when you have consumer debt. If you want more detailed information, I'd suggest e-mailing js_aid@cornell.edu.

Meet Cornell's Financial Aid Director

A conversation with Ann Richards, director of financial aid and associate director of admissions at Cornell's Johnson Graduate School of Management
Our guest on February 21, 2001, was Ann Richards, director of financial aid and associate director of admissions at Cornell's Johnson Graduate School of Management (No. 8 on BusinessWeek's 2000 Top 30 B-school list). Richards has worked at Cornell University since 1982, first at the Undergraduate Financial Aid Office, then at the Johnson School. She is a member of several national and regional financial-aid associations and has served on a number of financial-aid committees and advisory groups. She earned a BA from Wells College in 1980. Richards was interviewed by Lucia Quartararo for BusinessWeek Online. Here's an edited transcript of their discussion:

Q: Ann, tuition for the 2000-01 academic year was $27,600. Do you expect to see that number increase for the coming school year?
A: Yes, we have set our tuition rates for next year. The tuition for the fall and spring (2001-02) combined semesters will be $29,500. We have a very small, specialized program called the 12 Month Option program for students who have an advanced technical degree. They can complete their MBA in three semesters -- summer, fall, and spring -- and finish in 12 full months. Tuition for that program will be $18,000.

Q: On top of tuition and fees, what should a student budget for an entire year of study?
A: We have a computer requirement for first-year students, so the budget for first-years and second-years is slightly different. But the first-year student budget for the 2001-02 academic year -- that includes tuition, room and board, books, personal miscellaneous expenses, as well as health insurance and a laptop computer purchase -- is $46,045. And our second-year budget is $43,045, because [students] don't have that [$3,000] computer expense in there.

Q: The cost for two years of Johnson tuition and living expenses is closing in on the $100,000 mark and is on the rise. Is the hefty price tag a deterrent for prospective MBAs?
A: I'm glad you asked that because I'd like to make a plea to encourage students not to discount the possibility of going to school because of the cost. There are resources available to help everyone get their education. Sometimes it's not always easy, but there are resources and people shouldn't assume, because the school is $30,000 to $50,000 [a year], that they can't attend. People should look at the school that's the most appropriate for them, and then use the school's resources to find the most appropriate way to cover expenses.

Q: What is the Johnson school doing to ensure that as cost-of-living and tuition expenses increase, the scholarship budget does as well?
A: There are a lot of resources at work trying to address the issue of increasing costs. Our corporate affairs office is talking to corporations and businesses all the time about the increased cost of education and any assistance they can provide.

We also try to provide students with resources that they can use to help defray costs. We give them information on how to prepare financially for school, how to cut costs while they are a student, how to limit their overall borrowing amount. So there are ways [of keeping costs down] beyond just scholarship.

Q: There are two main ways to fund a Johnson MBA: merit-based scholarships and need-based loans. How much scholarship funding is available, and how many students receive merit awards?
A: We have about $1 million of merit-scholarship funding each year. The criteria [we use for awarding merit-based aid] is the same criteria that we use [during] the admission process, since our goal is to attract the top students with this funding. We look at academic experience, work experience, [recommendations], essays. We try to select roughly the top 10% of the class and award them with merit scholarships ranging from $5,000 to $20,000. [Awards] are renewed in their second year and [are] applied against tuition. Because we have $1 million, and some of our awards are substantial, we can only award funding to about 20% of the class, or 1 in 5 students. Citizenship is not an issue in the selection of the merit based scholarships -- they are open to all students.

Q: Is there a special scholarship-application form?
A: We have a scholarship-application form that's part of the admissions application. [Applicants] must apply by Jan. 15 in order to be considered for scholarship funding. We try to get notification to applicants within two weeks of the admissions decision.

Q: Are there any scholarship awards specifically earmarked for say, minority students, women, or other underrepresented constituencies?
A: We do have scholarships which have among their criteria, a preference for women or minorities or folks from New Jersey, as I mentioned. We also have an Office of Women & Minorities in Business, which has been around for a year and a half now. Angela Noble and her staff are actively working to secure funding on a variety of levels, not just scholarships. [They provide] a variety of resources for both women and minorities. It has [been] a tremendous success.

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Q: Another very appealing financing option is the Park Fellowship Program. What are the prerequisites to becoming a Park Fellow?
A: Park Fellowships are [geared to identify] potential leaders, reward them with significant financial support, and, in return, we expect that while they are a student, they will continue to develop their leadership abilities and experiences to the benefit of the school and the students here. [Applicants are required to write] an additional essay to apply. The Park Fellowships are limited to U.S. citizens. Thirty students receive the Park Fellowship each year, and it's a two-year award for full tuition, plus a stipend.

Q: A lot of schools don't encourage assistantships for first-year students. Some don't encourage them at all. What is Johnson's stance on this financial alternative?
A: We don't have assistantships in the traditional sense -- [we don't offer] tuition remission or tuition reduction. We do have students who work as teaching assistants and research assistants for our faculty, but they're paid on an hourly basis. We really discourage students from working in their first semester. In fact, few students work in their first year at all.

Q: Out of Johnson's total enrollment of 598 for the 2000-01 academic year, how many students receive some kind of loan assistance?
A: Probably about 300 students receive some form of loan assistance: either a federal loan, an institutional loan, or a private loan. The federal loans are, for the most part, need-based loans. There's a federal formula for determining financial need, and that's used to qualify some students for a subsidized loan.

Regarding institutional loans, we have a very limited amount of funding that we award on a case-by-case basis. The maximum [award] is $5,000 per year. It's used primarily to help students that have encountered some unexpected expenses or an emergency situation.

Lastly, private loans are a huge resource for [our students]. These loans are not need-based; they're credit-based. There are private lenders -- like Citibank, MBA loans, the Access Group -- who will perform a credit check and use the information accessed on the student's credit report to determine the terms of the loan (origination fees, interest rates, etc.) The most attractive borrowers get the most attractive rates.

Q: Some say that the poorer a B-school applicant looks on paper, the better his or her chances of getting financial aid. Is that true?
A: So many students think they're going to be penalized by having resources when it comes to funding their graduate education, and that is simply not true. The costs of an MBA education are so high that it is unlikely that a student will put themselves in a position where they won't qualify for loan assistance. Because more and more schools are offering merit-based as well as need-based awards, the fact that [prospective students] have prepared for their graduate education won't have an impact on whether or not they're selected for a scholarship.

Q: When should prospective students begin the financial aid research process, and when will they hear back from Johnson about their eligibility for loans and/or merit-based aid?
A: When an applicant first requests information or submits an admissions application to our office, we send them a letter telling them how to apply for loan assistance. We explain that they have to submit the Student Aid Report and a copy of their tax return. We try to notify [incoming] students [of their financial-aid status] within two weeks of their admissions decision. If [prospective students] wait until they're accepted before they apply [for financial aid], it could be four months before they hear about loan eligibility.

[When domestic students] apply for federal aid, we recommend they use the online FAFSA application. It's very quick. And if they have a copy of their tax return, it's [even easier], because the questions are all referenced to lines on the tax return. If [applicants] haven't filed their taxes for the year yet, they can use their estimated information.

Q: Securing funding can be complicated for international MBAs. Is there a foreign-friendly loan program that, for example, doesn't require a resident co-signer?
A: We're working on that. We don't have a loan program specifically for international students that does not require a U.S. or permanent resident co-signer yet. There are some resources that students can use to secure loans either through their own country or through an international organization. Canadian students, for instance, may qualify for the CanHELP Loan, which this Canadian Higher Education Loan Program. There's also The International Education Finance Corporation (IEFC), which will provide funding to international students. There's a special section that covers international loans on our Web site.

Q: The average age of a Johnson student is 29, a bit older than some of its peer schools. Are married students impacted at all when it comes to financial aid?
A: [An applicant's] status as part of a married couple isn't relevant to securing funding. It's not a factor that's taken into consideration in approving a private loan, for instance. Certainly, we may make adjustments to the cost of attendance for a student with a spouse or with dependent children, which means that they may qualify for additional subsidized loans. But generally speaking, it means additional private loans, because most of our students qualify for the maximum subsidized loans.

Q: Does an incoming Johnson student have to worry about competing with the entire Cornell community to get assistance from your office?
A: We really try to be an advocate for all of our students, whether [they are] new or returning. We're fortunate at the Johnson School, because we do have a dedicated financial-aid office. We're not farmed out from the university's financial-aid office, and we have a serious commitment to our students. We have an open-door policy, so students don't have to make an appointment or phone weeks ahead to see us. The student's purpose in coming to Cornell is not to deal with all the paperwork and red tape, it's to get an education.

Q: What tips does the school have for someone setting out to finance an MBA? What should future B-schoolers be thinking about as they head into this financial commitment?
A: In the very investigative stages, [prospective students should] begin to curtail their consumer spending, get rid of any credit-card debt, and save bonuses. Consumer debt is probably the biggest burden that haunts students when they get to school. It impacts them on two levels. First, it's a monthly obligation that they have to pay when they no longer have any income. And it has an impact on their credit rating and the rates that they end up borrowing their education funding on.

Meet Cornell's Placement Director

"I'm much less concerned about the two-dimensional portrayal of a candidate. Resumes are important, but they're the door opener. A resume doesn't necessarily get you a job. It's the three-dimensional self that gets you your job."

Our guest on May 18, 2000, was John Nozell, the director of career services and alumni relations at Cornell's Johnson Graduate School of Management [8th on BW's 1998 Top 25 list]. A graduate from Cornell, John got his MBA in 1983, and spent the next nearly 17 years with Chase as an investment banker first, and later held various investment-banking and corporate-finance jobs. Most recently, he ran the aerospace investment banking practice in London, covering Europe, Africa, and the Middle East. Mr. Nozell was interviewed by Business Week Online reporter Mica Schneider . Here's an edited transcript of that discussion:

Q: John, your most recent position was at an investment bank. How's that compare to life as a B-school's director of career services?
A: I haven't been on a learning curve like this in about 15 years. But it's been great fun, and I made it through one cycle.

Q: The center received high marks from students and recruiters in 1998. When you got to Cornell, what goals did you set for the placement center?
A: You don't want to come in with too many preconceived notions. I didn't want to do anything that would upset the apple cart out of naivete. Throughout the fall, I wanted to make sure that we didn't drop any balls with regard to what we were already doing well.

Q: Such as?
A: We have an impressive on-campus recruiting system and it's made all the more impressive by having a physical plant that's hospitable to recruiters. I wanted to ensure that we could provide the personal touch that [recruiters] had come to expect.

I didn't make drastic changes. Throughout the fall term, we tweaked a few things to make [company] presentations more suitable to students' schedules. Next year, we'll try to eliminate some of the conflicts, which could preclude a student from attending a presentation.

Q: With all that you figured out in year one, what will change in year two?
A: We're a small school with a relatively small physical plant, and we have maxed out the numbers of companies that can come here in earnest. That's a good thing, but we've tried to think of innovative ways to expand our capacity without losing the "touch" factor. So next year, we'll have a career fair here. It will be an all-day event with numerous ways for companies to reach our students.

Q: What kind of companies does the Johnson school want for that career fair?
A: Companies that have huge histories with this school and huge historical appeal for our students will garner their own presentation slots in a normal evening schedule. The career fair is not necessarily targeted at Old or New Economy companies, but at companies that have not come here before, or those that have but haven't had the numbers [of students] attending their corporate presentations that they wanted. This is a way to get a lot more exposure to students. That's going to be an all-day event where the school classes will shut down.

In the spring term, we began to cultivate our relationships with smaller companies through a Web-driven independent job search site. This is a way to reach the entrepreneurial sector that has suddenly emerged to recruit MBAs. This system helps us figure out how to meld their world with Old Economy companies. And the best way is to give them virtual access to our students. It gives our students a convenient way to introduce themselves to those companies. The next logical step is to have facilities to do the interview by videoconference. A company that may not have the resources or inclination to come here need not be denied access to our students.

bluemunich

Has anyone here had the experiences or offer from Cornell 12-month MBA program? I have a Ph.D degree in pharmacy and would like to know more about this program. Could anyone show me the rope? Thanks a lot!

laobob

laoge, thx, you are so nince!