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看看拿了CEIBS的MBA学位后能不能考博

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楼主
发表于 2005-4-12 12:16:00 | 只看该作者

看看拿了CEIBS的MBA学位后能不能考博

Several days ago, there was a guy claiming that “非中国正式学位,不能用来考博士的”. (Please refer to the sublink here: http://forum.chasedream.com/dispbbs.asp?boardID=16&ID=103161&star=1&page=1







This claim has really caught serious attentions and concerns, as deasy MM put it: 是这样的吗?我好像记得前几年,有一次公布教委认可的中外合作MBA里有中欧的吧?但如果真像yizhenghan说的那样,倒是挺麻烦的,哪里可以查这方面的信息?



With the attempt to clarify some information which could mislead CEIBS candidates, I wrote several letters to some leading universities around the world to inquire about this matter. All my letters are based on one ASSUMPTION that the master degree of CEIBS has been approved ONLY by Ministry of Education of China, not by the degree committee of the State Council of China.






The parts highlighted in light blue are response from each university I inquired.




























发件人 :



David Ray <dray@hbs.edu>



发送 :



2005年4月12日 4:22:27



收件人 :



"freeman" <ceibs_mba2005@hotmail.com>



主题 :



HBS Doctoral Programs (was Re: <SPAM>: Inquiry about doctoral program)





































Thank you for your interest in the Harvard Business School Doctoral Programs.

The only requirement for application is a bachelor's degree, so you are qualified, with or without the CEIBS MBA.

Eight programs are available through HBS. The Doctor of Business Administration (DBA) degree includes five possible areas of study:  Accounting and Control; Marketing; Policy and Management; Strategy; and Technology and Operations Management. Three PhD programs are offered in conjunction with various departments of the Graduate School of Arts and Science (GSAS):  Business Economics; Information, Technology and Management; and Organizational Behavior.

Applicants to all doctoral programs must submit the following:




  • a completed application form;

  • a resume;

  • a Statement of Purpose;

  • official transcripts of all undergraduate and graduate course work;

  • official GRE or GMAT scores for a test taken after January 1, 2001 (the GMAT is preferred, if possible);

  • three letters of recommendation; and


  • an application fee (in the form of a check from a US bank or a money order in US dollars).


Applicants whose native language is not English must also submit official scores for a test of English proficiency taken after January 1, 2004, with some exceptions. Applicants to the PhD programs are exempt from taking the TOEFL if they have any degree from an English-speaking institution. Applicants to the DBA program must have a four-year bachelor's degree form an English-speaking institution to be exempt from the TOEFL requirement. PhD applicants who are not qualified for one of these exemptions must submit scores from the TOEFL. DBA applicants who aren't qualified may submit either TOEFL or IELTS scores.

Successful candidates generally have standardized test scores in the 90th percentile, excellent records of academic performance, exemplary letters of recommendation, and well-defined research interests. Furthermore, they are committed to careers in research and teaching at top business schools.  HBS's nine doctoral programs prepare educators and researchers, academics whose thoughts will advance knowledge in the area of business.  A deep desire to pursue the intellectual frontiers in business coupled with the ability to realize such goals are important for success in HBS Doctoral Programs.

All doctoral programs are on-campus, full-time and begin in September. There are no distance learning options. Completion of a program typically takes four to five years. Admitted students receive fellowships covering full tuition, health care, and a living stipend ($27,000 in 2004) for four years.

Please note that HBS no longer produces a paper catalog. The application deadline for Fall 2006 enrollment will be December 15, 2005.  Applications for Fall '06 are available only online but will not be posted until Fall '05.

You can learn more about the programs by visiting the HBS web site at:
www.hbs.edu/doctoral.


-Doctoral Programs



Harvard Business School
Doctoral Programs
Sherman Hall 102
Boston, MA  ostalCode>02163ostalCode>
617.495.6101
www.hbs.edu/doctoral









To Whom It May Concern:



Thank you for your attention. I write to inquire whether I can apply for Ph.D. of marketing in your school.



I will graduate from China Europe International Business School (CEIBS) the end of this year. Had functioned in marketing-related field for almost 7 years prior to my admission into CEIBS in 2004, I am much fond of marketing. The wish to become a marketing teacher in China’s business schools after obtaining Ph.D. from such leading school as Harvard University occurred to me last year when I acquainted, for the first time, with Professor Linda G. Sprague, who graduated from Harvard in 1973 and currently is Professor of Manufacturing and Operations Management at CEIBS and Faculty Advisor to the CEIBS Case Development Centre. Subsequently, Professor Linda G. Sprague and I had several happy talks and her remarks to me inspire me to resolve on further pursuing Ph.D..



Several inquiries about the doctoral degree programs in Chinese domestic leading universities, such as laceName>QinghualaceName> laceType>UniversitylaceType> or laceName>BeijinglaceName> laceType>UniversitylaceType>, however, seriously discouraged me. I am not permitted to apply for the doctoral degree programme of those universities aforesaid, inasmuch as the master degree which will be issued to me and which has been approved by Ministry of Education of China is not approved by another education authority, the degree committee, which is affiliated to the State Council of China. The reason why the State Council refuses to approve the master degree is because the admission entrance test of CEIBS’s MBA program is not GRK organized by an entity in China but GMAT organized by ETS in America. However, it is the very business school, CEIBS, that enjoys, recently, the great success and good reputation not only domestically but also regionally, internationally. Its MBA program was ranked No. 22, whereas its EMBA program No. 20, round the world as per the well-known British-based Financial Times.



My question, therefore, is simply this. Am I qualified to apply the Ph.D. in your university after obtaining MBA degree from CEIBS?



Your efforts and time to reply my simple question would be highly appreciated.



Yours truly,



Freeman

























发件人 :



PHD Office <phdinfo@gsb.columbia.edu>



发送 :



2005年4月7日 21:45:32



收件人 :



Freeman <ceibs_mba2005@hotmail.com>



主题 :



Re: inquiry about doctoral program








































Hi freeman,



A bachelor's degree or the equivalent, representing a four-year course of study in an accredited college or university, is required for admission.



A master's degree is not required, although many applicants have the master's degree in such fields as economics, engineering, psychology, and statistics. Superior academic performance is expected. Those who hold American Ph.D. or Sc.D. degrees or their foreign equivalents are not normally eligible for admission. (Occasionally, an exception to this rule can be arranged.)



All candidates for admission must take either the Graduate Management Admissions Test (GMAT) or the Graduate Record Examination (GRE) given by Education Testing Service at numerous centers throughout the U.S. and abroad.



Thank you for your interest in Columbia Business School.



freeman wrote:





To Whom It May Concern:

Thank you for your attention. I write to inquire whether I can apply for Ph.D. of marketing in your school.



I will graduate from China Europe International Business School (CEIBS) the end of this year. Had functioned in marketing-related field for almost 7 years prior to my admission into CEIBS in 2004, I am much fond of marketing. The wish to become a marketing teacher in China’s business schools after obtaining Ph.D. from such leading school as Columbia University occurred to me last year when I acquainted, for the first time, with Professor Sprague, who graduated from Columbia in 1973 and currently is Professor of Manufacturing and Operations Management at CEIBS. Subsequently, Professor Sprague and I had several happy talks and her remarks to me were the encouragement and inspiration to push me to make final decision to further pursue Ph.D..

Several inquiries about the doctoral degree programs in Chinese domestic leading universities, such as Qinghua University or Beijing University, however, seriously discouraged me. I am not permitted to apply for the doctoral degree programme of those universities aforesaid, inasmuch as the master degree which will be issued to me and which has been approved by Ministry of Education of China is not approved by another education authority, the degree committee, which is affiliated to the State Council of China. The reason why the State Council refuses to approve the master degree is because the admission entrance test of CEIBS’s MBA program is not GRK organized by an entity in China but GMAT organized by ETS in America
. However, it is the very business school, CEIBS, that enjoys, recently, the great success and good reputation not only domestically but also regionally, internationally. Its MBA program was ranked No. 22, whereas its EMBA program No. 20, round the world as per the well-known British-based Financial Times.

My question, therefore, is simply this. Am I qualified to apply the Ph.D. in your university after obtaining MBA degree from CEIBS?



Your efforts and time to reply my simple question would be highly appreciated.



Yours truly,
freeman  












[此贴子已经被作者于2005-4-13 8:54:31编辑过]
沙发
 楼主| 发表于 2005-4-12 14:34:00 | 只看该作者

先申明,我是中欧的学生,欢迎因人废言,热情攻击。尽我所知说两句:


1. 中欧的学位是经过努力在两,三年前被中国教委承认的(具体哪年,记不太清楚,因为不关心,原因见后面)。为什么要努力,大家自己思考吧。承认的方式,据说是红头文件(有人说过,也记不清了)。红头这个东西,虽然我在国有企业呆了N年,至今一听就犯晕。


2. 在教委承认之前,中欧毕业生只要再多交几千元钱,就能拿到交大MBA学位。但据说很少有人感兴趣。原因见后面。


3. 我认为中欧的学位是被市场承认的,前提:中国会一直发展市场经济。如果有人不同意也不奇怪。如果有人不明白什么叫市场,申请MBA的,赶紧预习。在读的,退学得了,别浪费钱。已经读了的,哈哈,钱已经浪费了-sunk cost.


有人听说美国大学学位需要美国政府承认吗?我孤陋寡闻,没听说。


4.如果想到欧美继续读博,我认为有效。一个有EQUIS认证,和LBS,NYU每年大量交换学生的商学院,很难想象不被这些学校认可。此点存疑。因为到目前为止我没听说有中欧MBA继续深造的。师兄师姐们都忙着赚钱,谁想做学问啊。从这点看,窃以为,如果哪天有大量中欧,或者其他中国学校的MBA,开始读博士了,就是中国管理教育真正成熟了


如果想到国内名校读博,劝你也别来中欧了。尽然有人吃了牛排,想再喝棒子面,很难理解啊。建议直接去读他们的MBA得了,多省事啊。更省事的方法,掏钱买一个得了,费这么大劲干嘛。


5. 最重要一点,如果想读好的MBA,想做职业经理人或则做所谓leader啦,无论是出国还是在国内,坦率说已经选了一条体制外的道路。如果还想着什么国家承认,呆中国国有企业得了,别来读MBA。


from "yhyz" - a student of ceibs mba 04


[此贴子已经被作者于2005-4-12 14:35:25编辑过]
板凳
发表于 2005-4-12 15:35:00 | 只看该作者
恩,语者说得在理啊......
地板
发表于 2005-4-12 22:59:00 | 只看该作者

Truth teller or CEIBS MBA2005 美眉or freeman 兄台

I will graduate from China Europe International Business School (CEIBS) the end of this year. Had functioned in marketing-related field for almost 7 years prior to my admission into CEIBS in 2003, "你真的被中欧录取拉,恭喜啊。

如果有时间,您能给国内的博士点也写封信么?您这吃完牛排去吃洋棒子面没问题了,我们没准还要吃土棒子面哪。谢谢先。

5#
 楼主| 发表于 2005-4-13 08:56:00 | 只看该作者
以下是引用bluejellyfish在2005-4-12 22:59:00的发言:

Truth teller or CEIBS MBA2005 美眉or freeman 兄台


I will graduate from China Europe International Business School (CEIBS) the end of this year. Had functioned in marketing-related field for almost 7 years prior to my admission into CEIBS in 2003, "你真的被中欧录取拉,恭喜啊。


如果有时间,您能给国内的博士点也写封信么?您这吃完牛排去吃洋棒子面没问题了,我们没准还要吃土棒子面哪。谢谢先。






Be honest, I really don't understand what your reply is for. I can perceive there is a fiber of jeer in your remarks. (perhaps, I am oversensitive) If so, brother, do not bother. If not, all right, you are strongly expected to do so in person, because I want to practice my written english and extend inquiry simultaneously.


I think I must make one point clearly that in the original article the guy MERELY put "不能用来考博士". He did not, in particular, elaborate on "in which country" and "what sort of doctoral degree programs".


Whereas in my article, there is another underlying assumption that I am not permitted to apply for domestic universities, such as Beijing and Qinhua.





[此贴子已经被作者于2005-4-13 9:13:03编辑过]
6#
 楼主| 发表于 2005-4-13 09:27:00 | 只看该作者
如果想到国内名校读博,劝你也别来中欧了。尽然有人吃了牛排,想再喝棒子面,很难理解啊。建议直接去读他们的MBA得了,多省事啊。更省事的方法,掏钱买一个得了,费这么大劲干嘛
7#
发表于 2005-4-13 12:02:00 | 只看该作者
看看.呵呵!
8#
发表于 2005-4-13 21:14:00 | 只看该作者

考博的说法大概只有国内才有吧?而且国内的硕士美国从来就不承认,博士倒是可以直接去做postdoc,算工作。在美国上博士是不要求硕士学位的,用本科成绩申请,要上一般就是硕博一起读下来,中间老板放的话可以读完硕士就跑路,有没有MBA学位和上博士应该没关系的。

9#
 楼主| 发表于 2005-4-14 08:41:00 | 只看该作者
以下是引用Bergkamp在2005-4-13 21:14:00的发言:

考博的说法大概只有国内才有吧?而且国内的硕士美国从来就不承认,博士倒是可以直接去做postdoc,算工作。在美国上博士是不要求硕士学位的,用本科成绩申请,要上一般就是硕博一起读下来,中间老板放的话可以读完硕士就跑路,有没有MBA学位和上博士应该没关系的。



yes, you are right. I agree.
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