verbal 20求指导

xohe赵

1.Declining values for farm equipment and land,thecollateral against which farmers borrow to get throughthe harvest season, is going to force many lenders to tighten or deny credit this spring. (A)the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, is (B)which farmers use as collateral to borrow against to get through the harvest season, is (C)the collateral which is borrowed against by farmers to get through the harvest season, is (D)which farmers use as collateral to borrow against to get through the harvest season, are (E)the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, are D.  og说redundant。 谁能解释下 怎么redundant。use  as 可以这么用啊······

kiwifoodtown

可以用，但不等于这样就是最有效的

flonacui

我觉得collateral 做同位语修饰farm equipment and land   同位语修饰比较好 用定语从句which修饰不如同位语  而且use as 也不如直接用同位语简洁

flonacui

而且which修饰也不确定到底是修饰farm equipment and land还是单独land  所以同位语还是优选结构

xohe赵

而且which修饰也不确定到底是修饰farm equipment and land还是单独land  所以同位语还是优选结构

-- by 会员 flonacui (2012/11/21 11:17:36)

按你的思路走的话，如果是同位语，那么 the collateral  也不确定到底是修饰farm equipment and land还是单独land

伤追人

句子开头是Declining values for farm equipment and land，那就需要一个与之匹配的逻辑主语，which 应到的句子做逻辑主语与declining配不上啊。而且如果从句做主语的话，应该是用that做引导词。而且use ＋as不是很怪么, use什么as啊，也没有这样的搭配，最后against什么呢？

yiqing2012

我觉得这道题很有深度啊。。。其实我自己还不是完全明白，先说说自己的想法~

首先关于LZ的问题，我觉得这里的farm equipment and land应该不能用非限定which来修饰的，因为这里是特指那些被用来作为抵押的farm equipment and land~

之前我想到这里的时候就突然发现后面的against which(这是我觉得疑惑的地方)，虽然OG13上说对于that和which的限定和非限定还没有完全定论，但是做题目的时候发现官方的题目一般都还是倾向于限定用that并且前面没有逗号,非限定用which并且前面打逗号，那么这里against which为什么前面没有逗号呢？难道是因为介+which可以做限定修饰？

请NN解答~

xohe赵

Declining values for farm equipment and land 本身就是主语哈。所以不存在逻辑主语哦 ···

xohe赵

句子开头是Declining values for farm equipment and land，那就需要一个与之匹配的逻辑主语，which 应到的句子做逻辑主语与declining配不上啊。而且如果从句做主语的话，应该是用that做引导词。而且use ＋as不是很怪么, use什么as啊，也没有这样的搭配，最后against什么呢？

-- by 会员 伤追人 (2012/11/21 15:24:09)

Declining values for farm equipment and land 本身就是主语哈。所以不存在逻辑主语哦 ···

xohe赵

我觉得这道题很有深度啊。。。其实我自己还不是完全明白，先说说自己的想法~

首先关于LZ的问题，我觉得这里的farm equipment and land应该不能用非限定which来修饰的，因为这里是特指那些被用来作为抵押的farm equipment and land~

之前我想到这里的时候就突然发现后面的against which(这是我觉得疑惑的地方)，虽然OG13上说对于that和which的限定和非限定还没有完全定论，但是做题目的时候发现官方的题目一般都还是倾向于限定用that并且前面没有逗号,非限定用which并且前面打逗号，那么这里against which为什么前面没有逗号呢？难道是因为介+which可以做限定修饰？

请NN解答~

-- by 会员 yiqing2012 (2012/11/21 16:03:37)

对。我记得上高中的时候老师讲过，先行词放在介词后不能用that 而应该用which 并且看国外一个NN的解释哈
I think a lot of people get confused by the separation of a relative pronoun from the noun to which it's referring. That is, when I say:

"This is the post which will explain everything,"

it is easy to see that "which" refers to "post." It gets a little bit harder (but it shouldn't!) when I say:

"This is the post in which I will explain everything."

Here the word "in" is inserted but it's still okay. The reason that we have "in which" is that, logically, if we made the Relative Clause ("in which I will explain everything") into the main sentence, it would read: "I will explain everything in this post." So, since "post," replaced by "which" in the original sentence, would be the object of "in," "which" should also be the object of "in," so they have to go together: "in which" instead of "in the post."

No problem so far. But then it turns into this:

"This is the post the topic of which will be the explanation of everything."

Again, take the relative clause and pretend it's the main sentence. It would read: "The topic of this post will be the explanation of everything." This sentence would NOT make sense if we split up the left hand side. "Of this post, the topic will be the explanation of everything"? NO. The only way it makes sense is if "the topic of this post" is all together at the beginning of the sentence. As a result, when we use a relative clause, we have to slip "which" into its rightful place in the same construction. This leads us to the seemingly-awkward-but-actually-correct "the topic of which."

So, when you see a few words before the "which" or "who" or other relative pronoun, words that are part of the logic of the Relative Clause, realize that that's totally okay: the "which" still refers to the last noun or noun idea in the previous clause and, as long as it's in its rightful position in the logic of the relative clause, it's not only correct, it's actually grammatically clearer.


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