Vote: Chicago or Wharton or a US hedge fund

stq

I don't disagree with you.  If you read my original post, I clearly said that if he's set on HF, he should go to HF.

My comment above, which you responded to, was more about raising capital in an institutional setting and the value of your degree in that process.  I have always said previous experience is a must, but having the complete package definitely helps as well.  It's not about a MBA instead of your track record, it's about having a brand in addition to your track record.  It also depends on his work experience (which I also alluded to).  If he has Goldman and Citadel on his resume, then yea, adding Wharton doesn't really make a difference.  But if it's not a well-known name, then just having the numbers won't be as ideal.  Moreover, it's not just about the brand; it's also about the network....

As for taking two years off to go get a MBA, that's a personal decision.  In my opinion, two years is a short time if you took the long term perspective of your career.  Back in 2007, people right out of analyst programs were being promised $500K - $1MM at various funds.  The attitude was definitely anti-business school.  Even H/S/W MBAs were being questioned about their decision to get the degree in the first place.  It was almost like "did you not get a promotion? couldn't find a job?".  Of course, that was all before the financial crisis.  Half of those funds are non-existent today.  My point is, working for next two years has its own risks as well.  He could make it big, or it could go belly up fast.  In the end, the person has to decide what he wants to put on the table.

-- by 会员 REgirl07 (2010/3/31 16:20:15)

1 但这并不是in addition的问题，LZ面临的选择就是：如果去读书，必然意味着少2年的经验，这在我看来是非常不值的。

2 LZ现在工作的基金并不小，而且亚洲对冲基金大的就这么几家，就这么点人，圈子就这么大，读个W，利用W network的marginal benefit有限。 哪怕真的为了所谓的branding, 跳槽也比脱产读书两年强。

3 正是因为工作有很大的risk,所以现在才更要工作。。
HF整个产业过于volatile, 说穿了，大多数的人就在里面搏运气，亚洲市场更是如此，特别特别是Equity Long/Short这种。。不可控因素太多了。。
在这个行业2年时间可是非常的宝贵。。多少基金根本就活不过5年。。如果08年那波没挺过去，被laid off了，那么自然回头读书，机会成本也小。但最艰难的时间都挺过来了，眼看着将来这段时间起码现在看起来市场还不错，既然还能赚，干嘛不继续赚下去？能捞多少捞多少，谁知道还能捞多久？哪天不能捞了再回头读书也不是不可以。。
作HF，最大的一个问题就是淘汰率太高，一旦淘汰转行去其它行业比较困难，不比banking。所以MBA是个很好的insurance..
LZ还不到30，干嘛不继续工作下去，如果4-5年后你还能存活，那么到时候你的工作经验已经不需要读MBA了。如果运气不好，被淘汰了，起码你钱赚到手了，那时候还能回头读个MBA，想干嘛干嘛去。。
现在赚钱时机不错，干嘛浪费那么宝贵的2年去读MBA?

PS:不知道现在香港是怎么样的，是不是每年的bonus直接就是cash, 不过将来一个很有可能的趋势就是像banking这样搞很恶心的vesting,
就对冲基金这种volatility, 一搞那东西你损失不是一点半点，所以还是趁现在能捞尽量捞。。。

stq

我也不相信你一个本科毕业4.5年的南大毕业生可以拿到投行junior MD的base+bonus的水平。香港也不可能。请行内人出来评评真假。

-- by 会员 yyferboy (2010/3/31 16:02:48)

和哪里毕业无关，和在哪里工作有关。。交易员有自己的P&L，是有提成的。。
所以对冲基金的交易员 1百万美元一年，太正常了，一年数千万美元都一把把的。。只不过这行当的持久力差点，风险高点。。谁都不知道捞了今年还有没有明年。。

demoncraft

opinion from a outsider, it's not abt bschool or HF, it could be "bschool later" and "HF rite now"..

why don't u go for bschool say like 2 years later since u get such a great opportunity right now?

REgirl07

PS:不知道现在香港是怎么样的，是不是每年的bonus直接就是cash, 不过将来一个很有可能的趋势就是像banking这样搞很恶心的vesting,
就对冲基金这种volatility, 一搞那东西你损失不是一点半点，所以还是趁现在能捞尽量捞。。。

-- by 会员 stq (2010/3/31 17:16:53)

Haha, I think we both agree that MBA is a good insurance.  

Getting carry is worse than vesting...units from the past 3 years are pretty much all worth negatives for most PE funds.  Fun times.

moregel

I'm not sure if you discuss that with J.J. (other interviewer) in w's interview.
What he did say to me was that "you might not need it and still doing pretty well"; "however, if your goal is to raise your own fund at some point, as the 'REgirl' pointed out earlier, those fund of funds people look for 'brands' in your bio.  It might not be the most effective but surely an efficient way (btw, so do the bschools and I guess that's part of the reason why hbs allocates half admissions in China to Mck kids?)

Brand MBA is like an insurance. If you are Bill Gates or Chris Hsu (let alone what happened later), you don't need an MBA, not even an under degree.  But most people are not bill gates; or they are at least not sure if they are hehe...

In addition, for a cautious person (such as myself?), an MBA might also be sth you want to get it now for your retirement job 15+ years down the road?  Well, if you do make good fortune, you don't need such a job at all....

lhn8848

我也不相信你一个本科毕业4.5年的南大毕业生可以拿到投行junior MD的base+bonus的水平。香港也不可能。请行内人出来评评真假。

-- by 会员 yyferboy (2010/3/31 16:02:48)

和哪里毕业无关，和在哪里工作有关。。交易员有自己的P&L，是有提成的。。
所以对冲基金的交易员 1百万美元一年，太正常了，一年数千万美元都一把把的。。只不过这行当的持久力差点，风险高点。。谁都不知道捞了今年还有没有明年。。

-- by 会员 stq (2010/3/31 17:22:23)

能捞成那样的,估计也不在乎有没有明年了吧.

nspyhk

Thanks everyone again for your genuine advice.

Btw, my bonus is all cash, but there is a trend in the industy to have a 3-year vesting scheme now. For example, at Chilton etc.  

This would be pain in the ass.

necroosu

Chasedream上的sample还比较小，而且更多人与HF并不相熟。我不大清楚HF是否像PE或IB这样很激情得热爱着各种brand（我知道的Och-ziff就非常关心，虽然它PE和HF都有涉及到），建议LZ给你熟悉且能信任的HF业内的和head hunter打电话问问，听听整天在这一个行业里摸爬滚打的人的建议。

另外如前面的同学说了HF风险确实很大，稍不小心就blow up了，创始人和投资人都还okay，可怜的就是小兵们。来W当然也不错，不过像PE、HF、IM等确实是要求有过去的从业经验，这里就又是个chicken and egg的问题了。综合上来看，我觉得W或HF对LZ都不错，最后选哪个还是看HF业内人士的意见。

ytht234

好帖，有营养。感到mba有时确实很鸡肋，特别对于investment management来说

nspyhk

如果不是鸡肋，我也不会发贴抒发苦闷了