[求助]西北(Kellogg)和芝加哥(Chicago GSB)哪个"钱"途更好?

小sharon

还好还好，你只用了8天决定下来去那里。我以为你要用三个星期零六天呢

[此贴子已经被作者于2005-7-29 10:59:33编辑过]

wang10

决定去芝大最重要的原因是芝大的PROGRAM可以改.入学两个学期后,可以改成WEEKEND或EVENING的PROGRAM. 西北要一棵树钓死.刚开始我倾向KELLOGG.后来仔细研究了排名.觉得芝大的排名起伏小.(Have a low standard deviation).改为倾向芝大.又问了几个和我有同样决定的人为什么要这样选.什么因素起决定意义的都有.总的来讲2个选了KELLOGG2个选了CHICAGO.KELLOGG倾向于CASE STUDY.又改为倾向于西北.又问了几个美国同事.KELLOGG的REPUTATION似乎也没有想象中的好.基本差不多.后来又问了学校的POLICY.最后又POLL了CD的想法.决顶选芝大.还有一个原因.在国内说KELLOGG没人知道.说西北又老被人误会为甘肃的那所.不如芝大干脆.

Ranking	Year	Kellogg	GSB
School	2005	11	14
US News	2005	4	8
Business Week	2005	1	2
Wall Street Journal	2005	7	5
Forbes	2003	9	3
The Economist Intelligence Unit	2004	1	6
Financial Times	2005	11	6

IDAISY

西北可是美女云集阿，为什么说国内K没人知道呢？你是要什么圈子的人知道？在bw上看到一个比较很有意思，说和出租车司机聊天，你告诉他你为IBM或citibank工作，他会很impressed.但你和他说为goldman sachs工作，他可能会没什么反映，当你说你为carlyle or blackstone工作，他会更没有反应，但是MBA的圈子里你说这几个工作会怎么排序。道理一样，你和商业圈以外的人，谈MBA的排名没有意义。大部分中国人还不知道wharton呢，yale不是名气更响亮？而且对于C和K这两个基本排名差不多在一个层次的两个学校，再计较排名就意义不大，考虑学校氛围是不是爽，校友网是不是真可以利用到（有些学校校友比较冷漠），找工作的竞争是不是强（其实如果真要毕业后做金融，到K可能机会更多些，因为几乎所有上C的中国人都抱着华尔街，那么多人和你竞争）

如果金融形势好呢，C的中国人找工可能没问题。一旦经济形势发生变化，压力就大了。

mbacn02

exactly, IDAISY. Although I agree with you very much Kellogg is a very strong school, and actrually it is one of my favorate schools. But I just thought ur argument has some flaws. Because based on ur rational,Chicago should be more well known in so called elite bussiness circle. I happen to be in the finance industry,and from the name u gave: Goldman. the ex Chairman and CEO, current new jersey senator is from Chicago, and also Blackstone, the most elite private equity firm in my mind, their Chairman is also from Chicago....

IDAISY

以下是引用mbacn02在2005-7-31 9:05:00的发言：
exactly, IDAISY. Although I agree with you very much Kellogg is a very strong school, and actrually it is one of my favorate schools. But I just thought ur argument has some flaws. Because based on ur rational,Chicago should be more well known in so called elite bussiness circle. I happen to be in the finance industry,and from the name u gave: Goldman. the ex Chairman and CEO, current new jersey senator is from Chicago, and also Blackstone, the most elite private equity firm in my mind, their Chairman is also from Chicago....

i said, basically there is no much difference in reputations and overal rankings for these two schools, in this case, it doesn't make much sense any more to figure out these two schools, i.e. choose one from the other, through rankings, i mean, in this case, it's more viable to consider issues other than ranking.

no surprise you see maybe more names from C in finance companies because C is traditionally a finance school. but does this fact really matter that much for us? maybe not. when most chinese students cluster at C all fighting for a few ibanking spots, competition at K might be less fierce in that most ibanks also recruit at K and many of your classmates go for marketing and consulting.

by the way, part-time at Chicago doesnt hold the same weight as a full-time degree when you consider to change industry..

mbacn02

Fairly said. I just thought you quote some unproper names to support your first argument, and good luck for your application.

wang10

以下是引用IDAISY在2005-7-31 13:42:00的发言：

i said, basically there is no much difference in reputations and overal rankings for these two schools, in this case, it doesn't make much sense any more to figure out these two schools, i.e. choose one from the other, through rankings, i mean, in this case, it's more viable to consider issues other than ranking.

no surprise you see maybe more names from C in finance companies because C is traditionally a finance school. but does this fact really matter that much for us? maybe not. when most chinese students cluster at C all fighting for a few ibanking spots, competition at K might be less fierce in that most ibanks also recruit at K and many of your classmates go for marketing and consulting.

by the way, part-time at Chicago doesnt hold the same weight as a full-time degree when you consider to change industry..

Do not worry. I know what I am doing. I also know the competition in U of Chicago is much more fierce than Kellogg since the average GPA is U of C is just 3.2 and 2 out 3 in Kellogg will get an A.

IDAISY, you miss one important point. I plan to stay in U.S for next 5-10 years after graduation. Not only for myself, but also for my son. I do not want he experience what I have experienced to come here and compete in such a disadvantaged position. I am afraid that marketing and general management are not suitable to me because I have to use English to compete with top American graduate head to head in corporate. My old classmate just graduated from U of Michigan and has a hard time to find job after 3 month. He has tons of interview and one offer but just have hard time to land a suitable job. If you check, Michigan ranks 3rd in marketing or management.

To tell you the truth, top U.S students is not as dump as most Chinese thought. They are just like top student in Tsinghua and Peking, very intelligent. In some degree, they are better than Tsinghua and Peking’ graduate in that they process a great ability to communicate. Marketing and management rely heavily on communication. As I said, I had bad pronunciation and I do not think I will be great in management in United States. To be frankly, I am not impressed with the performance of Kellogg student staying in the United States. I know 3 Kellogg graduate in Motorola. One is applying for a financial banker job in Hong Kong. One is applying for a management job in Tian Jing. The third does not even want to apply any job after graduating for almost two years.

I do not want to bad-mouth Kellogg. I have one friend graduating from Kellogg, going to a St.Paul company as a business analyst and you know what, he came back after a year and land a programmer/architect again in Chicago. Management and Marketing is not the job for everybody, especially when you cannot communicate as good as you competitor and face race discrimination. If you are in Beijing or Shanghai, do you want your boss a Vietnam woman who speaks Chinese you cannot understand sometimes? If you don’t, you probably understand the feeling of your subordinate in here once landing high level management jobs. I have never heard a Chinese who is promoted to top management job (CEO/CFO) in a major U.S company except those who founded the company. On the other side, some top financial analysts in major brokerage firm are Chinese. Math and modeling are what we do. For example, 4-5 years ago, a mutual fund manager of year is a Chinese from Taiwan, although his Internet fund collapsed later.

I deem oral communication as one of my biggest baggage. I can never speak as well as my wife does, even after I took some class to reduce my foreign accent. If I plan to come back to China, I will pick Kellogg. In investment banking, I had a better chance. I can work behind a desk playing mathematics modeling and risk analysis. Using my strength in mathematics and analysis, I can beat most American, including 70% of American graduates from top 7 MBA program. Also, using your logics, if I really want to do management and marketing, I should pick U of Chicago anyway since the competition for those jobs in Kellogg is too much. I will definitely consider consulting when I am graduating. You know what, the biggest recruiter this year from U of Chicago is not any bank, but McKenzie consulting. BCG is also top 10.

In addition, I want to go to New York after graduation. Chicago is too small and boring.

To be frankly, I hope you can land Kellogg since you like the school very much. Think about it first for yourself before applying. What is your strength and what is your weakness. Utilized your strength and avoid your weakness. Just as in trading, you must have an edge or you are a sure money loser.

[此贴子已经被作者于2005-8-4 5:53:56编辑过]

飞雪

客观的说一句，“钱”途应该还是Chicago好。就像楼上那么多人说的，你去banking赚的钱是普通corporate没法比的，当然你工作的时间长度普通的corporate也是不能比的，呵呵。但是说进banking就可以避免自己语言的弱势我是不同意的，equity research这种职位的opening简直是凤毛麟角，竞争比banking的职位激烈很多。而banking对语言的要求是非常非常高的，可以说即使consulting firm觉得可以的水平，banking都不一定满意，当然如果你回HK，要求会稍微放松一点点吧。

当然，说一千道一万自己的背景比什么都重要，好的商学院只不过是给了你一个接近这些机会的机会。

jwodae

楼主还是没有道出葵花宝典秘笈。。。呵呵。

binshane

i prefer KELLOG, i like that