独立主格结构求总结呼唤大牛,斑竹,

wtx2490467

我看了之前的帖子,总感觉很散乱,看了之后也是一头雾水,感觉有的讨论对PREP语法笔记的总结也持否定态度.所以我自己看了看曼哈顿,虽然简短,也若有所误,好像没有那麽复杂.

独立主格两种情况
N. + N. Modifier
1. 表伴随
His head held high, Owen walked out of the store.
2. 表结果
Scientists have found high levels of iridium in certain geological formations around the world, results that suggest the cataclysmic impact of a meteor millions of years ago.

With + N
1. 表伴随
Owen walked out of the store with his head held high.
2. 我看讨论题有人说也表原因,我想表伴随也应该包括原因结果吧,我不确定,

总体来讲,有几句话我觉得值得深究,
1. Absolute phrases do not have to modify what they touch, they modify the main clause in some way.
2. The absolute phrase construction gives us a way to link a second sentence to the first.
3. At the end of a sentence, a result of the main clause can be written with either an absolute phrase of an -ing form.
Scientists have found high levels of iridium in certain geological formations around the world, suggesting the cataclysmic impact of a meteor millions of years ago.

总体来讲,我现在的想法是独立主格不管怎样,修饰的是前面的整个句子(是否修饰分句我不敢确定), 所以逻辑主语是一定要考虑的.
我其实就是想如果有大牛能够帮忙把这个语法点进行一个总结,那是再好不过了,能给我们这些同学帮助很大,谢谢大牛,

我又一句总结,不知道对不对,不敢怎么说,独立主格结构都是表伴随(结果,动作,原因...), 如果逻辑上和主句不同,不能表示伴随,那就是错的,不知道这样理解对不对,求批评.

蛋卷酱

tql

Evelyn_ho

晓嘉听话 发表于 2016-2-28 06:50
我想请问下Baby, 不是说独立主格不能跟从句的么，那这句为啥还是认为是独立主格呢？

Scientists have fo ...

你可以看一下第一页里面大家的讨论哦，没有说独立主格不能加从句。独立主格的结构是noun+noun modifier，noun modifier可以是介词短语，形容词，过去分词，现代分词（v-ing）, that从句（各种时态，不局限于主句时态）, 不定式。

晓嘉听话

babybearmm 发表于 2012-1-17 16:35
我觉得你总结得很赞！补充两点关于独立主格（也是来自Manhattan）：1. A phrase that consists of a noun a ...

我想请问下Baby, 不是说独立主格不能跟从句的么，那这句为啥还是认为是独立主格呢？

Scientists have found high levels of iridium in certain geological formations around the world, results that suggest the cataclysmic impact of a meteor millions of years ago.

abcde1996

baby姐姐总结的太好了！！！

cleotina

a~~ 看Baby的贴感觉都要成仙了，还在准备呢。 看来我差远了~~

ainiAnnie

非常感谢ls同学帮我指出

请问原贴在哪里？这块儿我不知道，学习下

-- by 会员 babybearmm (2012/4/21 16:20:29)

看了baby姐姐给的链接，
An absolute phrase is a word group that modifies an entire sentence.
也就是说 独立主格 修饰 主句，这点无异议了吧......(小M上也这么说的呀...)

babybearmm

非常感谢ls同学帮我指出

请问原贴在哪里？这块儿我不知道，学习下

jalline

Bearmm总结的很好，不过这个例子不对
absolute phrase不能接不定式，记得Manhattan的论坛上看到说过

The revenue this year is 30% higher than last, result to announce at the upcoming executive meeting

还想到个问题，Manhattan上说", v-ing"形式必须符合逻辑，一个典型的例子是如果表示purpose就要用不定式结构，不能用V-ing。另外，v-ing形式蕴含着和主句时态一致这个前提。
那么结合以上，并非所有独立主格表结果的结构都能用v-ing替换。
我编几个例子欢迎讨论：

The revenue this year is 30% higher than last, result that proves better marketing strategy.
The revenue this year is 30% higher than last, result proving better marketing strategy.
The revenue this year is 30% higher than last, proving better marketing strategy.

The revenue this year is 30% higher than last, result that will boost the stock price of the company in the near future. （让股票上涨是这个表达么？不太确定，请教大家）
The revenue this year is 30% higher than last, boosting the stock price of the company in the near future.
这个ing形式的句子就不对了！因为boosting作为进行时，必须跟从主句时态。这么写就改变了句意，似乎股票上涨是同时发生的，而不是in the near future.

The revenue this year is 30% higher than last, result to announce at the upcoming executive meeting.
The revenue this year is 30% higher than last, announcing at the upcoming executive meeting.
这个ing形式的句子也不对！这里根据句意，必须用不定式"to announce"不定式，不能用v-ing。

通过以上三组例子，我们发现作为修饰整个分句的结构，独立主格很灵活，而", v-ing"比较局限
独立主格=noun+noun modifier，这个noun modifier可能性很多，例如介词短语，形容词，过去分词，现代分词（v-ing）, that从句（各种时态，不局限于主句时态）, 不定式
而v-ing必须严格满足以下条件：1. 逻辑主语同主句主语； 2. 时态同主句时态； 3.逻辑关系，一般是标结果或者伴随，总之必须逻辑上make sense，例如必须用不定式表purpose或者将来的时候就不能用v-ing

我觉得你总结得很赞！
补充两点关于独立主格（也是来自Manhattan）：
1. A phrase that consists of a noun and a noun modifier and that modifies
a whole clause or sentence.   (p.291 Glossary)
就说独立主格并非要求跟主句的主语一致，独立主格的noun不要求是主句主语（his head 不等于Owen，results不等于scientists），但和主句有逻辑关系。

2. 关于独立主格或者v ing形式在后面表结果
Scientists have found high levels of iridium in certain geological formations around the world, results that suggest the cataclysmic impact of a meteor millions of years ago.
Scientists have found high levels of iridium in certain geological formations around the world, suggesting the cataclysmic impact of a meteor millions of years ago.

在Absolute Phrase一节中，作者讲In some cases, you can use an -Ing form (with a comma) in place of an absolute phrase.
就说并非所有独立主格都能换成V ing形式表达。这个some怎么理解？在讲present participle那部分的时候书中说
It (the Ing form) can even modify an entire clause as above, as long as the entire clause converted into a noun phrase could
function as the subject of the verb that is now in -Ing form. （强烈推荐细读这节,p 91）
就说前面这个分句作为整体，可以归纳为一个名词——results，而results又可以作为suggest的主语。这种情况下，results suggest...这种独立主格结构可以用v-ing结构替换。
这种前面分句可以归纳为一个抽象名词的情况，比较典型的，我觉得有results/report/observation/finding/trend这一类（这种通常Absolute Phrase里的noun modifier是that从句，即noun+that clause)，还包括increase这种（随便编个例子，"今年产量较去年增长多少多少，increase that leads to ..."或者作为ing形式的"今年产量较去年增长多少多少, leading to ..."，即前面那个句子可以归纳为increase这个词）。

另：表原因的例子有吗，我在Manhattan上没找到，可否举一个....

我看了之前的帖子,总感觉很散乱,看了之后也是一头雾水,感觉有的讨论对PREP语法笔记的总结也持否定态度.所以我自己看了看曼哈顿,虽然简短,也若有所误,好像没有那麽复杂.

独立主格两种情况
N. + N. Modifier
1. 表伴随
His head held high, Owen walked out of the store.
2. 表结果
Scientists have found high levels of iridium in certain geological formations around the world, results that suggest the cataclysmic impact of a meteor millions of years ago.

With + N
1. 表伴随
Owen walked out of the store with his head held high.
2. 我看讨论题有人说也表原因,我想表伴随也应该包括原因结果吧,我不确定,

总体来讲,有几句话我觉得值得深究,
1. Absolute phrases do not have to modify what they touch, they modify the main clause in some way.
2. The absolute phrase construction gives us a way to link a second sentence to the first.
3. At the end of a sentence, a result of the main clause can be written with either an absolute phrase of an -ing form.
Scientists have found high levels of iridium in certain geological formations around the world, suggesting the cataclysmic impact of a meteor millions of years ago.

总体来讲,我现在的想法是独立主格不管怎样,修饰的是前面的整个句子(是否修饰分句我不敢确定), 所以逻辑主语是一定要考虑的.
我其实就是想如果有大牛能够帮忙把这个语法点进行一个总结,那是再好不过了,能给我们这些同学帮助很大,谢谢大牛,

我又一句总结,不知道对不对,不敢怎么说,独立主格结构都是表伴随(结果,动作,原因...), 如果逻辑上和主句不同,不能表示伴随,那就是错的,不知道这样理解对不对,求批评.

-- by 会员 wtx2490467 (2012/1/16 22:47:21)

-- by 会员 babybearmm (2012/1/17 16:35:14)

-- by 会员 babybearmm (2012/1/17 17:18:33)

babybearmm

Thanks for your nice words.
不过这是我刚看完Manhattan的时候总结的，尽管说的没错，但没有归纳完全（毕竟那时候还没见过很多题目），更关键的是，那时候还只知道语法结构(absolute phrase = noun + noun modifier)，而不知道如何从句意上理解——为什么这个句子表达这个意思就可以用独立主格，那么当我在考场上拿到一个句子的时候，我如何判断它的最优表达就是用独立主格？

要我现在总结的话，我会直接建议大家看这里
http://grammar.about.com/od/basicsentencegrammar/a/sbabsolutephr.htm

最近被with独立主格卡死了！这个帖子是救星！baby很厉害而且回答超级耐心的。每个人的问题都超级仔细回答的。在准备复习的时候能找到一个能给出比较肯定答案的人是很重要的。还是要感谢baby

-- by 会员 MsDoughnut (2012/3/29 21:09:55)