关于OG13 114题海星题的句意理解。附WITH用法再归纳

wxtttt · 发表于 2012-11-16 16:37:29

这道题花了一个小时在上面，说说个人的理解和看法，欢迎讨论。

Starfish, with anywhere from five to eight arms, have a strong regenerative ability, and if one arm is lost it quickly replaces it, sometimes by the animal overcompensating and growing an extra one or two.

A one arm is lost it quickly replaces it, sometimes by the animal overcompensating and
B one arm is lost it is quickly replaced, with the animal sometimes overcompensating and
C they lose one arm they quickly replace it, sometimes by the animal overcompensating,
D they lose one arm they are quickly replaced, with the animal sometimes overcompensating,
E they lose one arm it is quickly replaced, sometimes with the animal overcompensating

正确答案B无误。

关于conditional sentence要求的平行，官方解释有，不在赘述。这里想说说这句话要表达什么意思，再看看几个小词对句意的影响和理解。
这里有with的两个用法，with的用法论坛讨论很多了，可以看看DUKB24的解答：http://forum.chasedream.com/GMAT_SC/thread-762597-1-1.html
总体来说：
- 不加逗号的时候，可以跳跃修饰主语或者最近的名词，这个根据句意确定（有时候GMAT会根据这个AMBIGUITY出题，特别是主谓宾结构时）。
- 加逗号的时候，可以就近就是名词或主谓或整个句子（修饰整个句子时，表承接关系，比如这道题和PREP129的正确句子：The honeybee’s stinger is heavily barbed and stays where it is inserted, with the result that the act of stinging causes the bee to sustain a fatal injury.）

那么这道题的句意模糊的地方在于：

1. overcompensating 和 growing 的关系，由于是AND的平行结构，给人一种这是两个东西的错觉。个人觉得是其实他们是一种能力，原因如下：
- 如果是两种能力，这个地方用OR会比AND更合适。
- AND可以表示cause-and-effect relationship，并不是说这两个就是两个东西，结构平行不代表句意平行，后面GROWING是对前一部分的进一步说明。

2. the animal overcompensating 不是一个词组，否则sometimes不能插入两个之中。the animal 这里是对海星的指代。

3. with这个地方表承接和伴随，跟PREP129的用法较为一致，有点破折号的味道，而不是通常认为的“用”的意思（不是类似BY的意思）。

---
可能会有人觉得琢磨那么久还不如多做几道题
但个人觉得，语义这东西，钻久了，成就感还是蛮大的～

MiaZhang · 发表于 2012-11-16 21:13:32

Starfish, with anywhere from five to eight arms, have a strong regenerative ability, and if one arm is lost it quickly replaces it, sometimes by the animal overcompensating and growing an extra one or two.

A one arm is lost it quickly replaces it, sometimes by the animal overcompensating and
B one arm is lost it is quickly replaced, with the animal sometimes overcompensating and
C they lose one arm they quickly replace it, sometimes by the animal overcompensating,
D they lose one arm they are quickly replaced, with the animal sometimes overcompensating,
E they lose one arm it is quickly replaced, sometimes with the animal overcompensating

Em...
楼主总结了很多~支持一下！

我想补充一点点，请指教：

其实with的用法没有特别复杂，从结构上来讲，GMAT常考的就两种情况：

一种是【with+n+形容词/介词短语/-ed/-ing】，这时候是独立主格结构，做整个句子的状语，with结构表示与主句之间紧密的逻辑关系。有时候with后面的名词还会和主语有一定的联系。独立主格结构的一大好处就是可以把两个分开的句子合成一个句子说
另外一种是【with+n+that定语从句】，这种结构不是独立主格，that后面是作为n的定语。关于这个结构到底是adjective还是adverb就不太好判断了。。。还是要看具体题目吧。。。

关于这道题，我是这么排除的：
sometimes by the animal...这个结构一看就不好。by后面如果加人表示动作的发出者，一般是用在被动语态里面的。主动语态里面，by通常加手段：do sth. by doing...。此外， sometimes成了修饰后面整个介词短语，逻辑上应该修饰compensating
然后，通过by the animal排除C。看到with独立主格结构，觉得很有好感。

再看前面的部分，it和they指代是不是清楚，有歧义的排除AD

E选项compensating和growing之间什么都没有，结构混乱。如果中间有个逗号的话，growing结构也不对，伴随和因果都不符合逻辑。排除

再看B， one arm is lost it is quickly replaced主语位置的代词指代都对称上了，with独立主格也很恰当。Bingo~

【注意：红色背影处本人理解有误！看7楼我补充的解释吧。。。对不住各位了】

wxtttt · 发表于 2012-11-16 22:07:17

谢谢Mia~受教了~
感觉这样子下来大家的语法绝对比老外强了。。。

不明白一点的是，【with+n+that定语从句】用法上和独立主格的区别是什么？比如说修饰对象的不同啊，之类的

sherry520 · 发表于 2012-11-17 11:03:26

1. 虽然我们从If, then的结构中就可以把选项A, D,E给
排除，但是这个句子的结构还是很复杂的
2. 两个with. 我认为第一个with表伴随修饰starfish（复数）拥有。。。第二个with. with用来解释前面这种情况。growing是对Compensating的进一步解释，结构应该保持一致。
with是有"因为"的意思：(the following explanations are from Longman dictionary)
释义: because of a situation that exists:
With John away there's more room in the house.
短语: with something doing something
I can't do my homework with all this noise going on.

MiaZhang · 发表于 2012-11-17 11:16:32

【with独立主格】是一定没有问题的，做状语，修饰整个句子。我认为，独立主格可以是作为给原句增加信息使用的，与主句关系紧密关于with的独立主格，有个题：
Because of wireless service costs plummeting in the last year, and as mobile phones are increasingly common, many people now using their mobile phones to make calls across a wide region at night and on weekends, when numerous wireless companies provide unlimited airtime for a relatively small monthly fee.
A. Because of wireless service costs plummeting in the last year, and as mobile phones are increasingly common, many people
B. As the cost of wireless service plummeted in the last year and as mobile phones became increasingly common, many people
C. In the last year, with the cost of wireless service plummeting, and mobile phones have become increasingly common, there are many people
D. With the cost of wireless service plummeting in the last year and mobile phones becoming increasingly common, many people are
E. While the cost of wireless service has plummeted in the last year and mobile phones are increasingly common, many people are

【with+n+that】是一般是修饰名词，具体是就近修饰还是修饰主语，就比较麻烦了。。。所以经常会有歧义
看个题：
In 1988, the Council on Economic Priorities began publishing Shopping for a Better World, with the simple thesis of consumers having the power to change companies by the simple expedient of refusing to buy.
A. with the simple thesis of consumers having
B. which had the simple thesis of consumers having
C. where the thesis was simple: consumers having
D. with a thesis that is a simple one: consumers have
E. whose thesis was simple: consumers have
A和D里面的with结构前面有逗号，结构上就与 Shopping for a Better World分离了，像是修饰主语，但是语义上，thesis应该修饰Shopping for a Better World这本书

D里面就有这个结构【with+n+that】

我觉得，【with+n+that】这个结构应该是就近修饰名词的时候没有歧义的，而且前面不加逗号。。。

关于这一点，还请NN和斑斑指教一下。献丑了

wxtttt · 发表于 2012-11-19 13:08:39

【with独立主格】是一定没有问题的，做状语，修饰整个句子。我认为，独立主格可以是作为给原句增加信息使用的，与主句关系紧密关于with的独立主格，有个题：
Because of wireless service costs plummeting in the last year, and as mobile phones are increasingly common, many people now using their mobile phones to make calls across a wide region at night and on weekends, when numerous wireless companies provide unlimited airtime for a relatively small monthly fee.
A. Because of wireless service costs plummeting in the last year, and as mobile phones are increasingly common, many people
B. As the cost of wireless service plummeted in the last year and as mobile phones became increasingly common, many people
C. In the last year, with the cost of wireless service plummeting, and mobile phones have become increasingly common, there are many people
D. With the cost of wireless service plummeting in the last year and mobile phones becoming increasingly common, many people are
E. While the cost of wireless service has plummeted in the last year and mobile phones are increasingly common, many people are

【with+n+that】是一般是修饰名词，具体是就近修饰还是修饰主语，就比较麻烦了。。。所以经常会有歧义
看个题：
In 1988, the Council on Economic Priorities began publishing Shopping for a Better World, with the simple thesis of consumers having the power to change companies by the simple expedient of refusing to buy.
A. with the simple thesis of consumers having
B. which had the simple thesis of consumers having
C. where the thesis was simple: consumers having
D. with a thesis that is a simple one: consumers have
E. whose thesis was simple: consumers have
A和D里面的with结构前面有逗号，结构上就与 Shopping for a Better World分离了，像是修饰主语，但是语义上，thesis应该修饰Shopping for a Better World这本书

D里面就有这个结构【with+n+that】

我觉得，【with+n+that】这个结构应该是就近修饰名词的时候没有歧义的，而且前面不加逗号。。。

关于这一点，还请NN和斑斑指教一下。献丑了

-- by 会员 MiaZhang (2012/11/17 11:16:32)

多谢MIA酱, 独立主格的语法点和其他的结构这下掌握了!

有个小疑问,PREP这道题是WITH + N + TAHT的形式, 但好像仍然是独立主格的形式呢?
The honeybee’s stinger is heavily barbed and stays where it is inserted, with the result that the act of stinging causes the bee to sustain a fatal injury.

MiaZhang · 发表于 2012-11-19 15:39:03

只能说这个结构是做状语，但是，我不同意很多人说“这里with结构是独立主格”。独立主格形势比较固定，就是我上面说的那几种

MiaZhang · 发表于 2012-11-19 16:16:23

~~只能说这个结构是做状语，但是，我不同意很多人说“这里with结构是独立主格”。独立主格形势比较固定，就是我上面说的那几种~~

-- by 会员 MiaZhang (2012/11/19 15:39:03)

嗯，刚刚又看了一下Manhattan，发现自己在看过Prep语法笔记之后，反而对【独立主格】【同位语】不太清楚了。。。

Manhattan对Absolute Phrases这么解释的：Absolute Phrases are composed of a noun and a noun modifier.these phrases do not have to modify what they touch, they modify the whole clause.
就是说，独立主格的结构应该是【Noun+Noun Modifier】

那么Noun Modifier有：Adjective, Preposition,Past Participle, Present Participle without comma, relative pronoun, another noun
而Appositive是：A noun that modifies another noun is called an Appositive(同位语).

那么独立主格的范围其实可以扩大到with+n+that的形式吧。。。
做状语，修饰前面分句

只是有时候with这个结构真的不是作为状语，尤其是n.+with+n.这种形式，这时候with+n只是一个介词短语
Deserts are inhabited by several distinct animal species, each with its own method of adapting to long periods of moisture shortage.

所以还是具体题目具体分析吧

我之前太武断了。。。还是以OG和Manhattan为准。。。

NN们请继续赐教

MiaZhang · 发表于 2012-11-19 16:40:53

不得不补充一句，with结构真的让人很头疼。。。这两天我一直在纠结这个语法点。。。

嗯，还是DUKB说得对，context is the king.

fpd · 发表于 2012-12-4 20:06:56

顶！刚刚对同位语，和独立主格的作用和用法有疑问，看了讨论终于搞懂了！

关于OG13 114题海星题的句意理解。附WITH用法再归纳

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