ChaseDream

标题: gwd 3-39 [打印本页]

作者: tianwan    时间: 2004-6-20 00:30
标题: gwd 3-39

Minivans carry as many as seven passengers and, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.



A.     Minivans carry as many as seven passengers and, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less,


B.     Minivans, which carry as many as seven passengers, compared with most sport utility vehicles, they cost less,


C.     Minivans carry as many as seven passengers, in comparison with most sport utility vehicles, and have a lower cost, they


D.     Minivans, carrying as many as seven passengers, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less,


E.      Minivans, which carry as many as seven passengers, compared with most sport utility vehicles the cost is lower, and they


The key is D, I choose A. Please help.


作者: rt316    时间: 2004-6-20 02:23

答案的确应该是D。

A的错误在于动词和形容词的不平行:carry.. and cost../ get.., allow.., and have..;as many as/ less, more, better, smoother

另外从逻辑上也有问题:compared with A, B...,B后强调的是差异,所以less, better,more, smoother这些比较级都合理,而as many as不强调差异比较。


作者: rt316    时间: 2004-6-20 02:27

另外,个人认为这个例子不好,因为即便是D,也存在句子结构不尽合理的地方。如果D被改为:

Compared with most sport utility vehicles, Minivans, carrying as many as seven passengers, cost less, 应该更好地表达句子的意思,而且结构合理。


作者: weiyu    时间: 2004-6-20 02:31

I agree with stoneren. But I cannot sure that past participle phrase "compared" can govern the subject "Minivans"???????


The same question discussed by mariezhu, LES, and tianwan several days ago.


I choose the same wrong choice A as does tianwan.



作者: rt316    时间: 2004-6-20 02:45
以下是引用weiyu在2004-6-20 2:31:00的发言:

I agree with stoneren. But I cannot sure that past participle phrase "compared" can govern the subject "Minivans"???????


The same question discussed by mariezhu, LES, and tianwan several days ago.


I choose the same wrong choice A as does tianwan.




如你所言,我也不认为compared修饰Minivans是清楚明确的,但是,从意思上讲肯定是修饰Minivans的,所以,我在3楼里提出对这题结构的优化。其实,这道题出得不好。
作者: tianwan    时间: 2004-6-20 19:40
I still hold that the A is correct. 2 levels of coordination are in the sentence: "[carry as many as seven passengers ]and , compared with most sport utility vehicles,[cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.]"
作者: LES    时间: 2004-6-20 20:17
Tianwan, I support you. I vote A.
作者: leo1111    时间: 2004-6-20 20:34
标题: 小弟一点意见,请各位大哥指点
Minivans ,分词作状语,谓语动词compared with.后面的cost,get,allow都是修饰成分。请各位高人指点。
作者: mariezhu    时间: 2004-6-20 21:16

agree on A


作者: bon    时间: 2004-6-20 21:41

个人浅见

cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.这几个部分应该连在一起,都是比较出的结果

carry as many as seven passengers 则是另一层意思,是比较的前的condition,

所以我认为选D正确,正如tianwan你所说,这两层意思是分开的


作者: LES    时间: 2004-6-20 22:03
以下是引用stoneren在2004-6-20 2:27:00的发言:

另外,个人认为这个例子不好,因为即便是D,也存在句子结构不尽合理的地方。如果D被改为:


Compared with most sport utility vehicles, Minivans, carrying as many as seven passengers, cost less, 应该更好地表达句子的意思,而且结构合理。



这个改动也是错的,因为COMPARE WITH强调的是事物之间的差异性,所以后面不可以用as many as。
作者: rt316    时间: 2004-6-21 01:03
以下是引用LES在2004-6-20 22:03:00的发言:


这个改动也是错的,因为COMPARE WITH强调的是事物之间的差异性,所以后面不可以用as many as。

不错,compare后的确强调的是事物间的差异,问题在于,Minivans后面的as many as结构是纳入在一个非限定结构中,用来说明Minivans的特点,其并不是主句成分,因此不属于比较范围。这点,恰恰是A的错误。


作者: juan    时间: 2004-6-21 01:14

I vote for A.

D. 中Minivans, carrying as many as seven passengers, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less, 显然是carrying...和compared....并列修饰minivans: 而compared with...可以和后面的cost less....构成合理的对比关系,carrying ....却不能,所以我觉得这里carrying...和compared ...并列不妥。


作者: rt316    时间: 2004-6-21 01:43
这道题如果要选A,and至少应该被替换为but
作者: robertchu    时间: 2004-6-21 04:28

I will vote for D instead :-)
A固然语法没错,但就意思的表达来说,D相对好些.一般英语一句话有一个中心idea,这里是Minivans are better thanmost SUVs. 能运到7个乘客只是peripheral idea, 同后面的”cost less...”在长度和意思上都不对称,所以还是D的表达捎好些.


作者: juan    时间: 2004-6-21 06:14
以下是引用stoneren在2004-6-21 1:43:00的发言:
这道题如果要选A,and至少应该被替换为but


I don't think it is necessary. Using "and" but not "but" is alsological.


open to discussion.


作者: opeman    时间: 2004-6-21 13:16

D会不会有歧异? 就是compared 到底是修饰passengers or the Minivans?


如果这样看来 确实A会比较好!


作者: weiyu    时间: 2004-6-21 13:56
以下是引用opeman在2004-6-21 13:16:00的发言:

D会不会有歧异? 就是compared 到底是修饰passengers or the Minivans?



如果这样看来 确实A会比较好!




D contains an abiguity; You may refer to an OG question


I have to note that choice B contains the ambiguous modification.


after doing..., doing.., star... (the second present participle is questionable modification part)


35.   A star will compress itself into a white dwarf, a neutron star, or a black hole after it passes through a red giant stage, depending on mass.


(A) A star will compress itself into a white dwarf, a neutron star, or a black hole after it passes through a red giant stage, depending on mass.


(B) After passing through a red giant stage, depending on its mass, a star will compress itself into a white dwarf, a neutron star, or a black hole.


(C) After passing through a red giant stage, a star’s mass will determine if it compresses itself into a white dwarf, a neutron star, or a black hole.


(D) Mass determines whether a star, after passing through the red giant stage, will compress itself into a white dwarf, a neutron star, or a black hole.D


(E) The mass of a star, after passing through the red giant stage, will determine whether it compresses itself into a white dwarf, a neutron star, or a black hole.


Choice A is ambiguous because the grammatical function of depending on mass is uncertain: the phrase could modify either the whole preceding statement or only the words after it passes through a red giant stage. In the latter case, choice A states in effect that a star depends on its mass as it passes through this phase, not the fate of the star depends on the star’s mass. Choice B suffers from the same ambiguity. Choices C and E illogically maintain that the star’s mass, not star itself, passes through the red giant stage to assume another form. Choice D is the correct answer for this difficult question


作者: leo1111    时间: 2004-6-22 12:57
以下是引用juan在2004-6-21 1:14:00的发言:

I vote for A.


D. 中Minivans, carrying as many as seven passengers, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less, 显然是carrying...和compared....并列修饰minivans: 而compared with...可以和后面的cost less....构成合理的对比关系,carrying ....却不能,所以我觉得这里carrying...和compared ...并列不妥。





个人意见认为这里的carrying和compared不可能是并列。如果是的话必须有连词连接。


如果是A的话,前后时态不一致。那么compared就应该改成compare.而且这里连词应该是S
+V+O,and V+O.应该没有A这种形式吧。


作者: juan    时间: 2004-6-23 00:04
以下是引用leo1111在2004-6-22 12:57:00的发言:





个人意见认为这里的carrying和compared不可能是并列。如果是的话必须有连词连接。


如果是A的话,前后时态不一致。那么compared就应该改成compare.而且这里连词应该是S
+V+O,and V+O.应该没有A这种形式吧。



compared是分词结构,这里不是compare的过去时.


open to discussion.


作者: leo1111    时间: 2004-6-23 00:55
以下是引用juan在2004-6-23 0:04:00的发言:



compared是分词结构,这里不是compare的过去时.


open to discussion.

如果从你的角度讲-ing and -ed形式的分词可以并列,但是中间是不是缺少连接词呢?

那么cost,get,allow and have,都是位于动词。但是个人观点认为,原句的意思在于minivans &  most sport utility vehicles比较后出现的如下优势。这么理解是不是有点改变原句意思。个人还是认为这句话的结构在于A ,carrying……,compared with B,cost less,get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.

请juan明示。

作者: juan    时间: 2004-6-23 01:21

Minivans carry as many as seven passengers and, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.

A.     Minivans carry as many as seven passengers and, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less,

B.     Minivans, which carry as many as seven passengers, compared with most sport utility vehicles, they cost less,

C.     Minivans carry as many as seven passengers, in comparison with most sport utility vehicles, and have a lower cost, they

D.     Minivans, carrying as many as seven passengers, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less,

E.      Minivans, which carry as many as seven passengers, compared with most sport utility vehicles the cost is lower, and they

我的意思是D中的compared不可能是compare的过去时,做这里的谓语动词,因为如果是谓语动词,就该是一般现在时。那么这里的compared就只能理解成分词形式了。如果是分词形式,那不就是和carrying….并列了吗?你说的没错。compared成分词形式后,前面得加个and,所以说这也是D的一错呀。不知道我这样说有没有清楚?多多讨论。


作者: leo1111    时间: 2004-6-23 01:36
以下是引用juan在2004-6-23 1:21:00的发言:

Minivans carry as many as seven passengers and, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.



A.     Minivans carry as many as seven passengers and, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less,



B.     Minivans, which carry as many as seven passengers, compared with most sport utility vehicles, they cost less,



C.     Minivans carry as many as seven passengers, in comparison with most sport utility vehicles, and have a lower cost, they



D.     Minivans, carrying as many as seven passengers, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less,



E.      Minivans, which carry as many as seven passengers, compared with most sport utility vehicles the cost is lower, and they



我的意思是D中的compared不可能是compare的过去时,做这里的谓语动词,因为如果是谓语动词,就该是一般现在时。那么这里的compared就只能理解成分词形式了。如果是分词形式,那不就是和carrying….并列了吗?你说的没错。compared成分词形式后,前面得加个and,所以说这也是D的一错呀。不知道我这样说有没有清楚?多多讨论。



谢谢你的解释,但是这里有一点不知道我有没有表述清楚。也许是我的理解错误。原句的意思是minivans和most sport utility vehicles比较后才能够得出cost……,不知道我这么理解对不对。


作者: juan    时间: 2004-6-23 01:55

你的理解没错啊。正是通过minivans和most sport utinily vehicles比较,才能得出cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride。所以更应该选A,因为carry as many as 7 passengers根本和后面这一串比较级的DD没联系,所以应该用A, carry.....and, compared with sth.,cost less.....你觉得呢?


作者: leo1111    时间: 2004-6-23 02:06

我不太确定是不是有这样的存在你说的这种结构。感谢你的帮助。


作者: juan    时间: 2004-6-23 02:14
你指的是我说的哪种结构呀?
作者: leo1111    时间: 2004-6-23 02:21

就是do and,do ,do and do


作者: juan    时间: 2004-6-23 02:43

我觉得不能纯粹看着这个结构。而应该结合逻辑意思。这题因为carry as many as 7 passengers和后面的比较是完全不同的2个范畴,所以用and隔开,分开讲。

个人意见。呵呵。。


作者: robertchu    时间: 2004-6-23 08:41
我弃暗投明, 投奔tianwan, mariezhu, 等诸多NN的阵营, 改选A !
原因: 用
现在分词结构"carrying as many as seven passengers"放在Minivans的后面, 感觉很奇怪 -- 找不到什么好理由为什么这里要用现在分词.

作者: rt316    时间: 2004-6-23 08:50
以下是引用robertchu在2004-6-23 8:41:00的发言:
我弃暗投明, 投奔tianwan, mariezhu, 等诸多NN的阵营, 改选A !
原因: 用
现在分词结构"carrying as many as seven passengers"放在Minivans的后面, 感觉很奇怪 -- 找不到什么好理由为什么这里要用现在分词.


非限定修饰是不是一个理由?Minivan可以坐7个人,这是Minivan的特点,用分词和定从修饰都不算过分。SUV大都只能坐5个人,和4门的sedan一样。其实,这个句子想表达的意思有很强的对比性,即:Minivan虽然可以坐多达7个人(比SUV多),但是却比SUV省油,等等。所以,A选项在语气上本身存在问题。如果第一个and被改为but,A还可以作为一个选项,否则平行结构混乱。
作者: leo1111    时间: 2004-6-23 10:58
以下是引用stoneren在2004-6-23 8:50:00的发言:


非限定修饰是不是一个理由?Minivan可以坐7个人,这是Minivan的特点,用分词和定从修饰都不算过分。SUV大都只能坐5个人,和4门的sedan一样。其实,这个句子想表达的意思有很强的对比性,即:Minivan虽然可以坐多达7个人(比SUV多),但是却比SUV省油,等等。所以,A选项在语气上本身存在问题。如果第一个and被改为but,A还可以作为一个选项,否则平行结构混乱。

同意stoneren的观点,个人认为这是个表示特点的句子。


作者: robertchu    时间: 2004-6-23 11:30
How about this :-)
Minivans can carry as many as seven passengers and, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less,
get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.
总而言之,这是一道怪题.如果真的出现在GMAT中,大概也只是不算分的实验题.

作者: 唐三彩    时间: 2004-6-23 11:48

看了各位的发言,总结一下:

A的结构是主语+do1 and do2,do3,do4,and do5, 应该说没有这样的结构存在,就算逻辑上合理也不能这么表达的,而且会误以为do1 和do2是并列关系呢。。。

此外,D选项中的2个分词短语应该都和后面的比较有关(因为比较的基础是大家都是运载7个人的交通工具,试想如果和集装箱货车比,当然便宜又灵活啦)。。而且把这2个短语看成插入语的话,就不需要理解是否并列不并列的问题了,呵呵。。。

Anyway,ETS有时自己出题也有问题的。。。。


作者: opeman    时间: 2004-6-23 11:50

Again, I vote for A.


The location of “Compared” in Choose D is ambiguous, it can referred to either “passengers”, or the “Minivan”.


作者: LES    时间: 2004-6-23 12:07

Minivans carry as many as seven passengers AND, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.

咳,对不起,偶又有点急了,大家为什么把这题看得这么复杂!

原题即A选项,大家这样看,以AND为界,前后两句话:
1. Minivans carry as many as seven passengers.

2. compared with most sport utility vehicles, (Minivans) cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.

是不是都成立!那么and可以连接两个独立的句子,连起来后,省略后半句的相同主语不就得了。

另外,这里用 and 不用 but,是因为 and 在这里表递进的关系。


作者: LES    时间: 2004-6-23 12:13
再补充一点,compared...在这里根本不是什么动词并列成分,而是状语!根据上面偶说的二分法看句子结构,就应该很明显了。
作者: robertchu    时间: 2004-6-23 13:55
Sounds good, LES!

作者: vincent0330    时间: 2004-6-25 22:35

原题即A选项,大家这样看,以AND为界,前后两句话:
1. Minivans carry as many as seven passengers.


2. compared with most sport utility vehicles, (Minivans) cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.


是不是都成立!那么and可以连接两个独立的句子,连起来后,省略后半句的相同主语不就得了。

要是表递进的话, 也应该是" 句子, and..."
作者: mariezhu    时间: 2004-6-26 00:18

he is a sales person and works at macy's

or

he is a sales person, and works at macy's?


作者: LES    时间: 2004-6-26 00:39

请注意,原句中的AND是紧接在前面的句子,而非“,”之后!

Minivans carry as many as seven passengers AND, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.


作者: vincent0330    时间: 2004-6-26 00:51

要是表递进的话, 也应该是" 句子, and..."

我说的是要是表"递进"的话......用 ", and " 会比较好


作者: vincent0330    时间: 2004-6-26 00:53

Minivans carry as many as seven passengers AND, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.

那照你这样说, 整个句子结构就是:

Minivans carry.....and cost....., get......, allow....., and have.....


作者: LES    时间: 2004-6-26 00:55
以下是引用vincent0330在2004-6-26 0:51:00的发言:

"


我说的是要是表"递进"的话......用 ", and " 会比较好


对啊,本题偶的选项就是用AND啊!看你上一楼的就是偶认为的最佳选项。


作者: vincent0330    时间: 2004-6-26 01:06

其实我觉得(A)不是那么好, 应该用分号或是句号等去分隔......

如像原句用and再加分词从句, 虽然突显逻辑上的意思并列, 但于语法上, 主结构所有动词共用一主语的情况,

用  V1 and V2, V3, V4, and V5 很不恰当.....

当然我没说(D)会更好, (D)也存在遥远修饰的问题......

再讨论.......


作者: robertchu    时间: 2004-6-26 01:15
扔硬币决定A or D 吧



作者: LES    时间: 2004-6-26 12:11
以下是引用vincent0330在2004-6-26 1:06:00的发言:

其实我觉得(A)不是那么好, 应该用分号或是句号等去分隔......


如像原句用and再加分词从句, 虽然突显逻辑上的意思并列, 但于语法上, 主结构所有动词共用一主语的情况,


用  V1 and V2, V3, V4, and V5 很不恰当.....-这个不是偶说的结构!


当然我没说(D)会更好, (D)也存在遥远修饰的问题......


再讨论.......



看来大家对这一结构还不是很熟悉,请大家仔细看看这个结构:


...V1 and,插入状语,V2...


下面在大全里搜索了一些例句,请参考。


1.        Bob Wilber became Sidney Bechet’s student and protégé when he was nineteen and, for a few years in the 1940’s, came as close to being a carbon copy of the jazz virtuoso in performance as anyone has ever come.


(A) as anyone has ever come
(B) as anyone ever had been
(C) as anyone ever had done
(D) that anyone ever didA
(E) that anyone ever came


2.        The caterpillar of the geometrid moth strikes when special tactile hairs on its body are disturbed, after capturing its prey, holds the victim so that it cannot escape.


(A) strikes when special tactile hairs on its body are disturbed,
(B) striking when special tactile hairs on its body are disturbed, but
(C) which strikes when special tactile hairs on its body are disturbed,
(D) which, striking when special tactile hairs on its body are disturbed,E
(E) strikes when special tactile hairs on its body are disturbed and,


大家还可以在大全里用“ and, ”来搜索更多的例子。


作者: satom    时间: 2004-6-26 15:06

According to public health officials, in 1998 Massachusetts became the first state in which more babies were born to women over the age of thirty than under it.


  1. than
  2. than born
  3. than they were
  4. than there had been
  5. than had been born

我觉得是C呀,为什么答案是A。谢谢!!


作者: kingsoft    时间: 2004-6-26 21:27

    我选A:

    D中的cost less。。。是针对compared with most sport utility vehicles而言的,如果将compared with most sport utility vehicles和carrying as many as seven passengers理解为并列,一起修饰主语。那么cost less就显得莫名其妙了

    A没什么问题:and 之后省略了Minivans,其实是and Minivans, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less...

   

   


作者: luoffice    时间: 2004-6-29 05:19

If A were "Minivans carry as many as seven passengers, and compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less,", I would choose A



well, after thinking it over, I would still choose D even A were modified.


reason: The sentence wanted to emphasize that "minivan is better than suv". In D, it used attributive "carrying......" to define minivan which can do the same as suv can, and used adverbial "compared with......" to indicate that comparisons are followed. In A, "carry......" is just a statement has nothing to do with the comparison.


look at this one:


Compared with most sport utility vehicles, minivans, which can carry as many as seven passengers, cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.


[此贴子已经被作者于2004-6-29 9:42:43编辑过]

作者: LES    时间: 2004-6-29 10:33
以下是引用luoffice在2004-6-29 5:19:00的发言:

If A were "Minivans carry as many as seven passengers, and compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less,", I would choose A

这样改了倒是绝对错误的!!!
作者: lucre    时间: 2004-6-29 11:01
以下是引用LES在2004-6-29 10:33:00的发言:
这样改了倒是绝对错误的!!!

do you think this is right?


Minivans carry... and cost... , get..., allow... , and have...


作者: LES    时间: 2004-6-29 12:03
以下是引用lucre在2004-6-29 11:01:00的发言:


do you think this is right?


Minivans carry... and cost... , get..., allow... , and have...



Oh, my God! 说了N遍了,偶理解的不是这个结构!!!


compared这里是过去分词,做状语,不是什么动词的一般过去式!!!


作者: lucre    时间: 2004-6-29 12:13

compared with most sport utility vehicles是状语没错


但是,“and,”是用来连接“carry”和“cost”的,和状语无关。


作者: LES    时间: 2004-6-29 12:41
以下是引用lucre在2004-6-29 12:13:00的发言:

compared with most sport utility vehicles是状语没错


但是,“and,”是用来连接“carry”和“cost”的,和状语无关。



你还是参考偶在46楼里说的方法到大全里去搜索一下类似的用法吧!
作者: LES    时间: 2004-6-29 13:01

再说最后一句,这种结构是:大并列里套小并列。


吃饭去了。


[此贴子已经被作者于2004-6-29 13:01:32编辑过]

作者: rhod    时间: 2004-7-1 13:50

觉得Les mm举的例子不具代表性,只能够说明V1 and V2的结构是对的,我想这点大家都承认。但是不能说明V1 and V2, V3, V4 and V5这样的结构也是对的。

总结一下双方的观点,A错在V1平行的层次不清,究竟V1和后面4个平行,还是V1和V2平行不能确定。D的问题在于compared的修饰不清,究竟是Minivans还是passengers,不能确定。

改错的答案是比出来的,所以大家没必要去攻击另一个选项的错误,因为都有错。问题是在于,哪一个是ETS能够容忍的,哪一个是不能容忍的。

我选D, 因为我觉得分词短语修饰不清的问题是可以容忍的。

同样有个例子,也是GWD的。

Q30:
The ancient Anasazi harvested such native desert vegetation as the purple-flowered bee plant, what they now commonly call wild spinach in northern Arizona and other parts of the southwestern United States.

A. what they now commonly call
B. a plant that they now commonly call
C. now commonly called
D. and is mow commonly called
E. which it is now commonly called

这个例子可能不太好,因为也有争议性。不过大多数人选C. 因为B里犯的错误是they指代了ancient Anasazi, 所以分词修饰不清的错误就是可容忍的。

所以,我认为本题应该选D.


作者: rhod    时间: 2004-7-1 20:58

正好又看到一个例子,大全里的。

           Believed to originate from a small area on their foreheads, elephants emit low-frequency sounds that may be used as a secret language to communicate with other members of the herd.

(A) Believed to originate from a small area on their foreheads, elephants emit low-frequency sounds that may be used

(B) Elephants emit low-frequency sounds that are believed to originate from a small area on their foreheads, and they may use this

(C) Elephants emit low-frequency sounds, believed to originate from a small area on their foreheads, that they may use

(D) Originating, it is believed, from a small area on their foreheads; elephants emit low-frequency sounds they may useC

(E) Originating, it is believed, from a small area on their foreheads, low-frequency sounds are emitted by elephants that may be used

选项C中也有分词修饰对象不清的情况,说明ETS能够容忍这个错误。


作者: LES    时间: 2004-7-1 23:37
请问rhod,这个例子里哪里有修饰对象不清的情况?
作者: rhod    时间: 2004-7-2 13:57
从纯粹语法角度,说believed分词短语可以修饰sounds,也可以修饰elephants.
作者: fair_sword    时间: 2004-7-10 00:59

3-39, I choose A.

D中的2重分词结构修饰,偶在GMAT好像没有看到,而A and, XX, B,却常常是正确答案的标志

楼上的例题:(D) Originating, it is believed, from a small area on their foreheads; elephants emit low-frequency sounds they may use

it is believed, 是插入语,这个例子里面没有修饰对象不清的情况


作者: bachordersee    时间: 2004-7-15 23:05
以下是引用rhod在2004-7-1 13:50:00的发言:

D的问题在于compared的修饰不清,究竟是Minivans还是passengers,不能确定。


对于D的主要争论主要是 carrying as many as seven passengers, compared with most sport utility vehicles  两个修饰成分的指代问题。 


可是仔细想一想 拿大活人和汽车比?可能吗?歧义歧义,不能脱离意思语义只从形式上考虑问题。这里根本没有歧义现象。


所以认为D是有道理的 


欢迎指正。


[此贴子已经被作者于2004-7-15 23:05:11编辑过]

作者: bachordersee    时间: 2004-7-16 22:01

顶一下


大家来讨论呀!一起把这道题弄清楚!



[此贴子已经被作者于2004-7-16 22:01:11编辑过]

作者: GreenHorse    时间: 2004-7-17 14:47


我收回,再仔细看看。


A: Minivans carry as many as seven passengers and, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.


两个AND肯定不行吧。去掉COMPARE那部分看看。


D: 我对CARRYING这类用法挺拿不准,不过只有她了。歧义倒是没有,说的是汽车,MINVAN是主语。


上面是昨天说的。


今天想想,还是选A,平常说话多半是这么说。第一个AND是大并列,表示比较前后的并列,第二个AND是小并别,表示比较后得到的属性并列。


D,歧义倒是其次,两个分词结构并列(carrying, compared)总觉得别扭。而且carrying这种现在分词修饰,多少总有点动作在进行的意思吧?(OG有一题有解释类似情况,在我心里留下了阴影,想不起来是哪题了。)


[此贴子已经被作者于2004-7-18 1:20:56编辑过]

作者: lucre    时间: 2004-7-19 08:51

仔细想了想,A的并列嵌套从语法上来讲也许有道理,但个人感觉是在abuse English,至少我在写文章时会尽量避免这种结构。而D,在主语后面跟上一大串并列修饰结构在英语里是很常见的。如大全951


            A substance from the licorice plant, 50 times sweeter than sucrose, was recently discovered, is not only a natural sweetener but also prevents tooth decay.


(A) A substance from the licorice plant, 50 times sweeter than sucrose, was recently discovered


(B) A substance, which was recently discovered, from the licorice plant, 50 times sweeter than sucrose,


(C) A substance from the licorice plant, which was recently discovered to be 50 times sweeter than sucrose,


(D) A substance from the licorice plant, 50 times sweeter than sucrose , which was recently discovered,(B)


(E) A recently discovered substance, 50 times sweeter than sucrose from the licorice plant,



[此贴子已经被作者于2004-7-19 8:52:05编辑过]

作者: GreenHorse    时间: 2004-7-19 12:55

楼上的例子C一定错吗?因为WHICH, 还是DISCOVERD TO BE? WHICH好像已经公认可以跳跃修饰了吧。

B,WHICH WAS DISCOVERED, FROM

逗号完全可以省掉。


作者: lucre    时间: 2004-7-19 14:31
以下是引用GreenHorse在2004-7-19 12:55:00的发言:

楼上的例子C一定错吗?因为WHICH, 还是DISCOVERD TO BE? WHICH好像已经公认可以跳跃修饰了吧。


B,WHICH WAS DISCOVERED, FROM


逗号完全可以省掉。


我好像没见过OG里which有跳跃修饰的例子

which was recently discovered,from the licorice plant,50 times sweeter than sucrose中的逗号起把from the licorice plant强调的作用,虽然省掉没错但语气有变化,小说里经常有这种句式。


作者: rhod    时间: 2004-7-19 19:57

今天想想,还是选A,平常说话多半是这么说。第一个AND是大并列,表示比较前后的并列,第二个AND是小并别,表示比较后得到的属性并列。

V1 and V2, V3, V4 and V5, 我们应该如何理解这里的大并列套小并列?

1) V2, V3, V4, V5是小并列, 然后和V1构成大并列

Or

2)  V1和V2大并列,然后和V2, V3, V4, V5构成大并列.

上述那种呢?


作者: enjoy7habits    时间: 2004-7-20 15:29

选A,

LES的解释也很不错。


作者: perpetual    时间: 2004-7-24 22:33
以下是引用GreenHorse在2004-7-19 12:55:00的发言:

楼上的例子C一定错吗?因为WHICH, 还是DISCOVERD TO BE? WHICH好像已经公认可以跳跃修饰了吧。


B,WHICH WAS DISCOVERED, FROM


逗号完全可以省掉。



c的意思就有问题,discover 的是substance, 不是to be 50 times.......
作者: chenger    时间: 2004-8-16 05:38
if D were right, " campared with ---" would have the possibolity to  modify "carrying seven----". that is, minivan, compared with---, can carry seven---.
作者: connee    时间: 2004-8-16 18:46

同意A,compared with most sport utility vehicles    是插入语,不同意stoneren 的看法,句子不应该改,因为原句表达的只有cost \get \allow\ have 是与“大部分车”比较出来的特点,而“carry 7个人”并不参与比较。

而D产生了严重的歧义,compared的逻辑主语变得有可能是“passengers".


作者: agk99    时间: 2004-8-16 19:09

這一題兩個月前就在討論了,哈哈,到現在還不見結果,這樣吧,我也來投個票

我投A,關鍵句我認為是插入句


作者: tony6    时间: 2004-8-19 17:34

我认为A没有任何问题,并且,compared with在A中位置比D中的carrying ..., compared with还要好


作者: tony6    时间: 2004-8-19 18:25
以下是引用LES在2004-6-23 12:07:00的发言:

Minivans carry as many as seven passengers AND, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.


咳,对不起,偶又有点急了,大家为什么把这题看得这么复杂!

原题即A选项,大家这样看,以AND为界,前后两句话:
1. Minivans carry as many as seven passengers.


2. compared with most sport utility vehicles, (Minivans) cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.


是不是都成立!那么and可以连接两个独立的句子,连起来后,省略后半句的相同主语不就得了。


另外,这里用 and 不用 but,是因为 and 在这里表递进的关系。



LES的解释已经不能再清楚了
作者: createdream    时间: 2004-9-9 07:51

A A A  the answer is AAA


作者: leeon    时间: 2004-9-9 08:57

A并不正确,compared with most sport utility vehicles 是插入语正确,比较的是Minivans和most sport utility vehicles;A变成了比较Minivans 载客人的数量和most sport utility vehicles比较,后面又说cost less....,存在着严重的逻辑问题。

先看个例句吧:

The average working week in Japan is 42.3 hours, compared with 41.6 in the UK,so they are not too badly off.

A将carry变成谓语,变成了宾语载客人的数量与其他交通工具的比较,逻辑不通。

这里的carry部分只能用作定语修饰主语Minivans ,然后插入语compared with most sport utility vehicles,说明是Minivans和most sport utility vehicles比较。纵观5个选项,只用D符合要求没有其它语法错误。


作者: agk99    时间: 2004-9-10 21:15

看來我要改變我對這題的看法了

Minivans carry as many as seven passengers and, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.

這是原句,但就是因為那個 and(Minivans carry as many as seven passengers and,)造成後面的平衡出現文法上的錯誤

沒有辦法,A的錯誤就是這麼一個,沒有移除A之前,即便是D的結構怪怪的,還是只能選D


作者: 流沙    时间: 2004-9-14 10:39

这道题目我认为D是正确的。做的时候没想那么多,只是觉得这个句子从逻辑意思上来看,它的重心应该在比较方面,carry应该使用动名词结构来修饰主语。

至于很多人说的compared with修饰含糊的错误,我的看法是这样的,分词的作用对象一般先看是否修饰主语,如果逻辑不对再看是否修饰其他词。所以这里面是需要加上句子逻辑进行判断的。像这句话,passenger与vehicles是绝对不会比较的。

看了大家的讨论,对A的错误倒是坚定了,它的并列结构更加含糊。相比D而言,这个错误更加不能容忍。


作者: Andrea625    时间: 2004-9-24 15:41

Minivans carry as many as seven passengers and, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.


D.     Minivans, carrying as many as seven passengers, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less,


A中没有突出重点(说车的比较优势),carry as many as seven passengers and反而突出了不可比、不想比的一个特点。从意思上讲,D优。偶觉得这种复杂插入语在杨鹏难句里比比皆是啊。这个结构很好。


作者: hiddragon    时间: 2004-10-2 19:17
vote A
作者: JerryGuan    时间: 2004-10-2 22:33

呵呵,好久没有参加语法的讨论了。难得的好贴,我也发表一下我的看法:


关于此题,我有80%的把握是D,20%是A。


初看A时没有错误,但看到D时,我很满意!为什么?


因为:D说得很清楚,只有相同条件下,比较才有意义,也就是说:只有在马车载同样多的人时,比较出来其他的条件。而A(虽然语法不一定错)割裂了这个完整的意思。正如luoffice说的这样:


以下是引用luoffice在2004-6-29 5:19:00的发言:

If A were "Minivans carry as many as seven passengers, and compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less,", I would choose A



well, after thinking it over, I would still choose D even A were modified.


reason: The sentence wanted to emphasize that "minivan is better than suv". In D, it used attributive "carrying......" to define minivan which can do the same as suv can, and used adverbial "compared with......" to indicate that comparisons are followed. In A, "carry......" is just a statement has nothing to do with the comparison.


look at this one:


Compared with most sport utility vehicles, minivans, which can carry as many as seven passengers, cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.


两个修饰语修饰1个名词,中间加逗号隔开是可以的,见:


以下是引用lucre在2004-7-19 8:51:00的发言:

仔细想了想,A的并列嵌套从语法上来讲也许有道理,但个人感觉是在abuse English,至少我在写文章时会尽量避免这种结构。而D,在主语后面跟上一大串并列修饰结构在英语里是很常见的。如大全951


            A substance from the licorice plant, 50 times sweeter than sucrose, was recently discovered, is not only a natural sweetener but also prevents tooth decay.


(A) A substance from the licorice plant, 50 times sweeter than sucrose, was recently discovered


(B) A substance, which was recently discovered, from the licorice plant, 50 times sweeter than sucrose,


(C) A substance from the licorice plant, which was recently discovered to be 50 times sweeter than sucrose,


(D) A substance from the licorice plant, 50 times sweeter than sucrose , which was recently discovered,(B)


(E) A recently discovered substance, 50 times sweeter than sucrose from the licorice plant,



关于这个并列修饰问题,以前讨论过。。。


从句子整体意思出发,就可以轻松解这道题了。


我一直有这样的体会:


做语法让人沉浸在细节中,容易在分析各个关系的潜心中,忘了句子的整体意思。


[此贴子已经被作者于2004-10-2 22:34:47编辑过]

作者: woodorstone    时间: 2004-10-3 00:15

我觉得应该是D。

同意楼上,我觉得D没有问题,很好。

不能太钻进去而出不来,

gmat语法让我们了解:the system of English grammar and its convention,errors that effect clarity, and techniques of effective sentences. 然后,能写出(而不是读懂)漂亮的句子,因此,不妨多站在一个写者的角度考虑如何安排一个句子。


作者: JerryGuan    时间: 2004-10-3 10:25

楼上的,你怎么用了我以前的头像,可知,我才是JERRY!!!


作者: woodorstone    时间: 2004-10-3 12:18
呵呵,我也很喜欢jerry, 难道只许你用?
作者: dream1111    时间: 2004-10-19 08:46

A,

The order of structure of 'Minivans, carrying as many as seven passengers, compared with most sport utility vehicles, ' in D obviously is not one we like. Does anyone ever see an example like this? At least there should be an 'AND' between 'passengers', and 'compared ' in D.

I think A is good one in terms of grammar, as well as logic .


作者: 似水年华    时间: 2004-10-19 09:18

Minivans carry as many as seven passengers and, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.


选项A, 我们把compared with most sport utility vehicles去掉:

Minivans carry as many as seven passengers and cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.

多了一个and.

所以个人浅见,答案是D.


作者: byebyelove    时间: 2004-10-19 16:23

OG.190. Manifestations of Islamic political militancy in the first period of religious reformism were the rise of the Wahhabis in Arabia, the Sanusi in Cyrenaica, the Fulani in Nigeria, the Mahdi in the Sudan, and the victory of the Usuli “mujtahids” in Shiite Iran and Iraq.

(A) Manifestations of Islamic political militancy in the first period of religious reformism were the rise of the Wahhabis in Arabia, the Sanusi in Cyrenaica, the Fulani in Nigeria, the Mahdi in the Sudan, and

(B) Manifestations of Islamic political militancy in the first period of religious reformism were shown in the rise of the Wahhabis in Arabia, the Sanusi in Cyrenaica, the Fulani in Nigeria, the Mahdi in the Sudan, and also

(C) In the first period of religious reformism, manifestations of Islamic political militancy were the rise of the Wahhabis in Arabia, of the Sanusi in Cyrenaica, the Fulani in Nigeria, the Mahdi in the Sudan, and

(D) In the first period of religious reformism, manifestations of Islamic political militancy were shown in the rise of the Wahhabis in Arabia, the Sanusi in Cyrenaica, the Fulani in Nigeria, the Mahdi in the Sudan, andE

(E) In the first period of religious reformism, Islamic political militancy was manifested in the rise of the Wahhabis in Arabia, the Sanusi in Cyrenaica, the Fulani in Nigeria, and the Mahdi in the Sudan, and in

I think there should be ","before first" and"

Such as OG190 (E)


作者: almarabbit01    时间: 2004-10-24 07:32

我支持stoneren, 此题选D


作者: looook    时间: 2004-10-28 12:58

从第1页,看到9页,感觉象stoneren一派和LES一派的对决啊, 而且象小说一样激烈,精彩. 本以为stoneren后来会再来总结一次的,可是看到最后,也没看到,失望中…, 不过我是stoneren一派.
支持D
A和D都不是完美的. A中前后关系不够清楚,D中compared...离修饰的名词太远.
我觉得JerryGuan的理解很好,
个人也认为本句的逻辑意思是: 载着同样是7个乘客的M,比起大部分运动用车辆, cost less.,…… (其实这是常识, 任何车型的比较都要考虑载荷, 行驶路面,时速等因素, 比如很多人说日本小车好,省油,但如果让它拉满5个大人,在高速上跑180, 那才叫老牛拉破车. 扯远了.)
D是这个逻辑意思的很好的表示, 就是说carrying…是用来表示在什么条件下比较. 而如果能把Carrying…提前( Carrying as many as seven passengers, Minivans, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less,)或把它前面的逗号去掉(Minivans carrying as many as seven passengers, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less,)会更好.
而A没有表示出这种逻辑意思. stoneren也提到如果把”passengers and,”变成 “passengers but,” 从逻辑上变成一种对比关系,可以接受.
但A V1 and V2, V3, V4 and V5中在语法上讲就是V1,V2小平行,然后又和V3,V4,V5组成平行,而无法理解出V2, V3, V4, V5小平行,又和V1形成大平行. 如果如LES所说V2, V3, V4, and V5是后面又一个句子的省略形式,那么后面的句子应该是用”, and”开始,不应该是在前面句子后面附件一个and, 并且实际上这样做也不可行,因为句子变成了Minivans carry as many as seven passengers, compared with most sport utility vehicles, and cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride. compared with就变的无所是从了.当然如果是Minivans carry as many as seven passengers, and, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.同样compared with也很很怪.

open to discuss.


作者: hiddragon    时间: 2004-11-2 17:45
以下是引用stoneren在2004-6-21 1:43:00的发言:
这道题如果要选A,and至少应该被替换为but

我想and和but都是连词,既然可以用but,那么也可以用and.

vote A.


作者: robertchu    时间: 2004-11-3 09:33

Just stopped by and saw this hugely long discussion.  Although I haven’t been involved in this for quite a while, I feel that I should contribute my 2 cents and try to draw some sense of closure to this question.

I choose A.

D, with two modifying phrases (one present participle and one past participle) between the subject and the verb, is very awkward.  Nobody will say or write sentence like this unless in some twisted ETS questions.

On the other hand, A is no doubt the best answer.  Why?  See this:

Minivans (carry as many as seven passengers) and, ([compared with most sport utility vehicles], cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride).

It’s both grammatically correct and logically sound.

One more comment: very few SUVs can carry as many as seven passengers.  So the “carry as many as seven passengers” is not used to set up the logical context for the comparison between Minivan and SUV.


作者: 无痕若雪    时间: 2004-11-3 13:35

选A!


作者: dajiqi    时间: 2004-11-5 13:59

这道题目越看越有味道. 我选A.



其实翻译出来就可以看出A 要比D强, 更好的表达了意思, 即MINIVAN的优越性:



MINIVAN可以装载7个人之多, 并且(and, 表示递近的意思)SUV比起来更A,B,C and D



选项D 并没有大错, 只是比较起来, 不如A 好.



Minivans, carrying as many as seven passengers, compared with most sport utility vehicles, cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.


最好改为:


Compared with most sport utility vehicles, Minivans, carrying as many as seven passengers, cost less, get better gas mileage, allow passengers to get in and out more easily, and have a smoother ride.


是不是更好看一些, 而且, 过去分词的修饰也更加得体, 明确.



石头人说 ”其实,这个句子想表达的意思有很强的对比性,即:Minivan虽然可以坐多达7个人(比SUV多),但是却比SUV省油,等等。”


为什么不能说该句子想表达的意思有很强的递近的意思呢?


如果要表达对比转折的意思, 在原句中应该有提到SUV载客比MINIVAN少, 但是却在很多方面消耗还大….



欢迎讨论


作者: flowerrainn    时间: 2004-11-18 02:54

虽然答案没有定论,但A这种 大AND 套小AND 的形式OG的确有例

Some bat caves, like honeybee hives, have residents that take on different duties such as defending the entrance, acting as sentinels and to sound a warning at the approach of danger, and scouting outside the cave for new food and roosting sites.

(A) acting as sentinels and to sound

(B) acting as sentinels and sounding

(C) to act as sentinels and sound

(D) to act as sentinels and to soundB

(E) to act as a sentinel sounding

但从逻辑意思上讲,好像又该选D


[此贴子已经被作者于2004-11-18 2:55:15编辑过]

作者: pinkrouge    时间: 2004-11-30 11:32
D
作者: tempture    时间: 2004-12-3 10:20
很耐心的看完了10页,彻底迷惑了....从逻辑意思来说,我觉得D比较对,但是A确实没有错
作者: 爱维的天    时间: 2004-12-3 13:05

GWD3-39
呵呵!这题的讨论可很长啰!
我也是选﹙D﹚啦!
只是我觉得﹙A﹚这样的表达方式虽然”文法”上可以,
但没有﹙D﹚好就是了
两边支持的人都有,看以什么条件为优先考虑就是了.


作者: hpp920    时间: 2004-12-5 08:57
支持A
作者: Sebastian    时间: 2004-12-9 16:47
以下是引用bachordersee在2004-7-15 23:05:00的发言:


对于D的主要争论主要是 carrying as many as seven passengers, compared with most sport utility vehicles  两个修饰成分的指代问题。 


可是仔细想一想 拿大活人和汽车比?可能吗?歧义歧义,不能脱离意思语义只从形式上考虑问题。这里根本没有歧义现象。


所以认为D是有道理的 


欢迎指正。



希望大牛指点一下,什么时候能判断为歧义?是否如bachordersee所说,须当两种说法都不会明显得出荒谬意思的情况下,才可判定为歧义?


作者: jadelo    时间: 2004-12-12 03:45
以下是引用tempture在2004-12-3 10:20:00的发言:
很耐心的看完了10页,彻底迷惑了....从逻辑意思来说,我觉得D比较对,但是A确实没有错


這一題還沒有定論嗎?


為什麼很多NN都覺得A沒有錯呢?


個人以為,A犯了個雖不起眼但很嚴重的錯誤:它把逗號放在連接詞"and"之後了。


以下節錄自某英文語法和寫作網站:


When a parenthetical element — an interjection, adverbial modifier, or even an adverbial clause — follows a coordinating conjunction used to connect two independent clauses, we do not put a comma in front of the parenthetical element.


·         The Red Sox were leading the league at the end of May, but of course, they always do well in the spring. [no comma after "but"]


·         The Yankees didn't do so well in the early going, but frankly, everyone expects them to win the season. [no comma after "but"]


·         The Tigers spent much of the season at the bottom of the league, and even though they picked up several promising rookies, they expect to be there again next year. [no comma after "and"]


(This last piece of advice relies on the authority of William Strunk's Elements of Style. Examples our own.)


這題的"compared with most sport utility vehicles" 很明顯就是parenthetical的用法,而這樣的插入語放在連接詞(如and)之後時,在and 及插入的句子中間不應該有","。



此外,我翻遍了整本OG語法的部份,找不到有"....and,....."這樣的結構的,只有 "....., and....."的結構。(當然,也許是我眼花沒找著,還請有疑惑者一起來幫忙找找看)








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