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标题: 再问GWD7-Q17 [打印本页]
作者: toamy 时间: 2009-10-3 14:28
标题: 再问GWD7-Q17
Of patients over 65 years old who survived coronary bypass surgery—a procedure widely prescribed for people with heart disease—only 75 percent benefited from the surgery. Thus it appears that for one in four such patients, the doctors who advised them to undergo this surgery, with its attendant risks and expense, were more interested in an opportunity to practice their skills and in their fee than in helping the patient.
Which of the following, if true, most seriously undermines the argument?
- Many of the patients who receive coronary bypass surgery are less than 55 years old.
- Possible benefits of coronary bypass surgery include both relief from troubling symptoms and prolongation of life.
- Most of the patients in the survey decided to undergo coronary bypass surgery because they were advised that the surgery would reduce their risk of future heart attacks.
- The patients over 65 years old who did not benefit from the coronary bypass surgery were as fully informed as those who did benefit from the surgery as to the risks of the surgery prior to undergoing it.
- The patients who underwent coronary bypass surgery but who did not benefit from it were medically indistinguishable, prior to their surgery, from the patients who did benefit
E正确。
因为如果医生在手术前不知道手上的病人会不会benefit from the surgery,那么他们就无从决定自己为病人动手术的动机。
不过我的问题是：为什么不选A呢？ 原文是说65岁以上的人有四分之一的概率无法从手术受益，从而推出有四分之一的概率医生是在为自己“练手”而让病人开刀。
如果做手术的大部分都是55岁以下的人，那是不是根本就推不出这个四分之一，从而削弱结论呢？
请各位指教指教。。
作者: momoshine 时间: 2010-1-22 17:37
削弱点不对，A的范围不对 不要削弱原文信息
作者: clarry 时间: 2010-1-22 18:40
A无关。 但E也不怎么消弱。大概用GMAC的逻辑就算是消弱了吧。我倒觉得D有点消弱。
作者: a2710 时间: 2010-2-2 15:16
请问C变成是Support原文吗? (我原先选C)
作者: langrenly 时间: 2010-2-3 02:29
这道题显然是E吧。
A的话，GMAT的逻辑题，一个答案本身也要求题目中有明确逻辑线索，题干中并没说55岁以下病人做手术是什么情况，也许这个手术年龄越低风险越大呢？
C和D均无关，题目问的是医生的道德风险，这两个选项说的都是做手术是否能反映病人的主观意愿，但是医生忽悠病人让病人相信这个手术对他们有利，这也是道德风险的一部分。
E正确，因为医生事先无法知道手术结果，那么建议病人做一个75%成功率的手术，显然无关乎道德问题。
Of patients over 65 years old who survived coronary [C1] bypass surgery[C2] —a procedure widely prescribed for people with heart disease—only 75 percent benefited from the surgery. Thus it appears that for one in four such patients, the doctors who advised them to undergo this surgery, with its attendant risks and expense, were more interested in an opportunity to practice their skills and in their fee than in helping the patient.
Which of the following, if true, most seriously undermines the argument?
- Many of the patients who receive coronary bypass surgery are less than 55 years old.
- Possible benefits of coronary bypass surgery include both relief from troubling symptoms and prolongation of life.
- Most of the patients in the survey decided to undergo coronary bypass surgery because they were advised that the surgery would reduce their risk of future heart attacks.
- [C3][C3] The patients over 65 years old who did not benefit from the coronary bypass surgery were as fully informed as those who did benefit from the surgery as to the risks of the surgery prior to undergoing it.[C4]
- The patients who underwent coronary bypass surgery but who did not benefit from it were medically indistinguishable, prior to their surgery, from the patients who did benefit
E正确。
因为如果医生在手术前不知道手上的病人会不会benefit from the surgery,那么他们就无从决定自己为病人动手术的动机。
不过我的问题是：为什么不选A呢？ 原文是说65岁以上的人有四分之一的概率无法从手术受益，从而推出有四分之一的概率医生是在为自己“练手”而让病人开刀。
如果做手术的大部分都是55岁以下的人，那是不是根本就推不出这个四分之一，从而削弱结论呢？
请各位指教指教。。
-- by 会员 toamy (2009/10/3 14:28:00)
作者: gtr 时间: 2010-2-5 05:29
Of patients over 65 years old who survived coronary [C1] bypass surgery[C2] —a procedure widely prescribed for people with heart disease—only 75 percent benefited from the surgery. Thus it appears that for one in four such patients, the doctors who advised them to undergo this surgery, with its attendant risks and expense, were more interested in an opportunity to practice their skills and in their fee than in helping the patient.
Which of the following, if true, most seriously undermines the argument?
- Many of the patients who receive coronary bypass surgery are less than 55 years old.
Possible benefits of coronary bypass surgery include both relief from troubling symptoms and prolongation of life.
Most of the patients in the survey decided to undergo coronary bypass surgery because they were advised that the surgery would reduce their risk of future heart attacks.
[C3] The patients over 65 years old who did not benefit from the coronary bypass surgery were as fully informed as those who did benefit from the surgery as to the risks of the surgery prior to undergoing it.[C4]
The patients who underwent coronary bypass surgery but who did not benefit from it were medically indistinguishable, prior to their surgery, from the patients who did benefit
E正确。
因为如果医生在手术前不知道手上的病人会不会benefit from the surgery,那么他们就无从决定自己为病人动手术的动机。
不过我的问题是：为什么不选A呢？ 原文是说65岁以上的人有四分之一的概率无法从手术受益，从而推出有四分之一的概率医生是在为自己“练手”而让病人开刀。
如果做手术的大部分都是55岁以下的人，那是不是根本就推不出这个四分之一，从而削弱结论呢？
请各位指教指教。。
-- by 会员 toamy (2009/10/3 14:28:00)
其实这个论断有很多潜在假设，我先列出三个，攻击任何一个都可以：
1. 医生主观上能够分辨谁是真的需要手术，谁是不需要的 （标准答案攻击的是这个）
2. 医生有练手和赚钱的欲望和需求
3. 医生能够决定该不该做手术的
至于4分之一，题目已经说了，就这四分之一的人而言，如何如何，所以四分之一是given，不是结论的一部分。
作者: Cresent 时间: 2011-7-23 11:55
我刚刚也错选了A，但是Thus开始的那句话中明确指出one in four such patients，我觉得这里逻辑链所针对的对象就是大于65岁的病人。所以A应该是无关选项。个人意见~
作者: mdautobox 时间: 2011-8-19 09:50
整个事件的中心 是医生做不做手术 是为了！#￥#@的原因~
而只有E 是说医生的~~
A小于55 逻辑中常见的无关的错误
B 也没有从医生的角度
CD均是说patient的~
作者: shenlisha 时间: 2011-9-21 16:10
我就没看懂题目的意思。最后句话啥意思啊？懂不起，水平太有限。。。
作者: 何倩倩 时间: 2011-11-22 03:54
E的意思为：受益和没收益两批人手术前在医疗上是分不出的。既然分不出，医生就无法对一批人动机好，对另一批人动机不好。
作者: hartmann 时间: 2011-11-22 12:34
A所指病人的范围有问题。
原文指：patients over 65 years old who survived coronary bypass surgery. 即手术成功，而且成活的病人
A选项指：patients who received coronary surger. 即所有接受手术的人，包括手术失败，并死亡的病人
同时，这段话的结论不是1/4的病人（手术成功的）没从手术中获益，而是医生让这些病人做手术的目的，是锻炼医术和赚钱。
这个结论需要一个潜在充分条件：医术事先知道这1/4是无法从手术中获益的。
E直接攻击了这个条件，因此选E。
作者: leadlife 时间: 2013-6-17 22:28
我把原文的结论理解错了，原文结论：Thus it appears that for one in four such patients, the doctors who advised them to undergo this surgery, with its attendant risks and expense, were more interested in an opportunity to practice their skills and in their fee than in helping the patient.
The patient, not the four patients.
作者: 御寒 时间: 2016-12-19 09:59
gtr 发表于 2010-2-5 05:29
Of patients over 65 years old who survived coronary [C1] bypass surgery[C2] —a procedure widely ...
同意！
作者: OasisTseng 时间: 2017-1-10 12:08
其实 gmac 有时候也会削弱原文条件 但是前提是 这样条件 是 subconclusion 是由上一环推出来的
但是这里 65 已经是直接给出的条件 A 中的 55以下没有涉及 也不是题目所要求的讨论范围内 所以 A不对
作者: 不一样的刘二傻 时间: 2017-8-1 05:41
想问下 为什么不能说 医生为了拿钱 不管是谁 只要得了这个病的都去劝他们做手术 不管他们会不会有benefits， 那这样不就是说为了拿钱么。 感觉E并没有怎么削弱啊
作者: 卢卡斯247 时间: 2017-8-22 16:35
可以这样理解：并不是医生主观的想去赚钱才建议做手术的，而是必须通过做手术才能看出病人的情况
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